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Recently noticed "OU Fish" on Worcestershire sauce.

Can it be used on fleish/steak?

verbatim
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    Are you assuming that fish cannot be eaten with meat? Sourcing assumptions, even commonly held ones, is valuable. – mevaqesh Feb 08 '17 at 08:53
  • Is the question "can fish be eaten with meat" or "what does 'OU Fish' symbolize"? – Double AA Feb 08 '17 at 21:28
  • http://judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/13287/if-chicken-eggs-are-parve-is-caviar-considered-fish?rq=1#comment22264_13287 – Double AA Feb 08 '17 at 21:30
  • What about Sefardim who can't eat fish with cheese? (Not sure who would put Worcestershire sauce on pizza, but everyone's different.) – DonielF Feb 08 '17 at 21:41

  • Is the question "can fish be eaten with meat" or "what does 'OU Fish' symbolize"?

    I already know you can't eat fish w/fleish,

    For me the question is: since the sauce says OU Fish, are we permitted to use it for fleish? I have seen kosher cookbooks that list Worcestershire sauce as an ingredient in some fleish recipes. Does that mean there are some Worcestershire sauces that do not include fish? Is the OUFish just a warning for the machmir since the sauce is not actual pieces of fish? Is it straight up asur to use (then if so, why do I see it listed in some kosher cookbooks)?

     – verbatim Feb 09 '17 at 23:21
  • @verbatim You should put important info in the question by [edit]ing. Stuff in the comments isn't going to be seen by most people. You should also consider that things you know (such as "you can't eat fish w/fleish") are not known by all and/or are not agreed to by all, so it's best to clarify how you know them if you can. For instance, the Rambam doesn't mention any prohibition consuming fish with meat, and some Yemenites I believe still follow that. – Double AA Feb 13 '17 at 03:17
  • similar http://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/67692/759 – Double AA Mar 15 '17 at 15:49

1 Answers1

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The OU site has an article on this. The explain:

Therefore, products that contain amounts of fish that are not batel b’shishim must be labeled OU Fish, so that consumers will not unwittingly eat the product together with meat. If the amount of fish in the product is batel b’shishim, we do not require the product to be labeled OU Fish, provided that the fish ingredient is mentioned somewhere on the packaging. In this way, those who wish to be machmir for the opinion of Taz can do so by scanning the ingredient label. If the fish ingredient is not listed on the label or is ambiguous, (Omega-3 oil) then the product should be labeled OU Fish.

They seem to say that your Worcestershire sauce should not be eaten with meat, unless it's the label omits the fish ingredient (or it's ambiguous like Omega-3 oil), in which case you could eat it with meat unless you're stringent to pasken like the Taz.

So check the label, and then - based on your Minhag and the ingredients - you'll know the answer.

BTW: Anchovies are small, common salt-water forage fish of the family Engraulidae. The 144 species are placed in 17 genera; they are found in the Atlantic, Indian, and Pacific Oceans, and in the Black Sea and the Mediterranean Sea. Anchovies are usually classified as oily fish.

Danny Schoemann
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  • Having actually asked this while working as a moshgiach for a kashrus organization, I was informed that the anchovies were in fact batel bashishim (at least according to the rav in charge). – Isaac Kotlicky Feb 08 '17 at 10:48
  • @IsaacKotlicky what with the AChsheve? – kouty Feb 08 '17 at 11:52
  • @IsaacKotlicky - then I guess anchovies are either not on the label or the OU considers them ambiguous and they invoke the 2nd half of their statement about the Taz. – Danny Schoemann Feb 08 '17 at 12:42
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    @IsaacKotlicky Possibly this brand of sauce uses a different formulation than that one. – Double AA Feb 08 '17 at 14:44
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    Note the OU did not Paskin that the sauce can't be used with fish. It's just informing people there is more than 1/60th fish so they can implement their rabbi's Psak appropriately. – Double AA Feb 08 '17 at 14:45
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    For instance, your rabbi might permit you to add it as a mixed-in seasoning (but not a dipping sauce) because then the fish content will end up being nullified in the whole dish. (Though I don't get why the OU is focusing on 1/60 here. Clearly the fish is Avida leTaama.) – Double AA Feb 08 '17 at 15:03
  • @kouty I have no clue. I called and was given psak of what the hechsher allows. no halachic explanation was given me, but it was clear that the product (which listed anchovies in the ingredients) was not considered problematic. – Isaac Kotlicky Feb 08 '17 at 20:18
  • The Star-K of Baltimore, the OU, the CRC, the Kaf-K, Rabbi Eli Mansour, a posek for the Syrian Jewish community in America and Chabad all hold that it is prohibited to consume or cook fish and meat together. In the words of the CRC, this is the practice of all Torah observant Jews. – Yaacov Deane Feb 09 '17 at 00:11
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    @YaacovDeane Your claim about the CRC's words appears to be false. I can't find those words on the CRC's website. I found http://www.crcweb.org/ask_rav/fishwmeat.php where it says "...[the Chumra's] continued acceptance throughout the centuries by Torah observant Jews." – Double AA Feb 09 '17 at 04:57
  • "unless it's the label omits the fish ingredient (or it's ambiguous like Omega-3 oil), in which case you could eat it with meat unless you're stringent to pasken like the Taz": no. Maybe the ingredient list doesn't include fish, and the fish isn't batel. – msh210 Feb 14 '17 at 23:32