-5

Traditional calendar has two Shabbats in a row. For example, Passover 2008 was preceded by Shabbat. 1st day of Passover is a Holy Meeting and it is called a shabbat too. Calendar can't have two miqra qodesh in a row because Hebrews would have nothing to eat on the second Shabbat as Manna did not fall out that day. Can someone explain this?

Basically, how can we have two Holy Meetings in a row in traditional calendar?

This is a question about traditional calendar.

New Moon is also a"moed". It is called so in Bemidbar 28:2 and Bemidbar 28:11.

Aleksandr Sigalov
  • 122
  • 1
  • 2
  • 11
  • 1
    You're incorporating multiple ideas into your question, here, so I'm uncertain what the focus is. Are you concerned about the definition / usage of the term "Shabbat", "Mikrah Kodesh" or when Manna fell, to make your point? Please clarify this in the question, not via comments. And what does "traditional calendar" mean. If you mean the Judaic calendar that we use, today, that didn't exist in the desert at the time of the Manna. – DanF Jan 25 '16 at 21:33
  • @DanF I think my question is clear. How can we have two shabbats in a row? – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 21:35
  • 3
    For me, it is not clear, which is why I asked the questions that I did. Up to you if you wish to clarify. – DanF Jan 25 '16 at 21:36
  • How do we know that hagim fell out of Friday/Sunday before our current calendar? Unless you know they were, the question doesn't apply – mbloch Jan 25 '16 at 21:41
  • The answer is Rosh Chodesh wasn't a Shabbat. It was excluded from the cycle. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 21:42
  • What do you mean? I am talking about Passover. Sukkot has the same problem too. – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 21:43
  • 1
    possible dupe http://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/61657/759 related http://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/13933/759 – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 21:58
  • @AleksandrSigalov According to Lunar Shabbat theory, the seventh day of Pesach is a Miqra Kodesh and always has a Lunar Shabbat the next day. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 22:01
  • 1
    How do you know no Manna fell on Yom Tov? The verse only says Shabbat – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 22:02
  • @DoubleAA All Miqra qodesh are Shabbats. It says so in the Torah. Vaikra 23 – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 22:04
  • 3
    @AleksandrSigalov Sorry, the verse only says the manna didn't fall on the seventh day. It doesn't indicate that every miqra kodesh had this property. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 22:06
  • @DoubleAA Shemot 16:26 says explicitly "shabbat". All miqra qodesh are called shabbat shabbaton (special shabbats). Also, it would not be unreasonable to assume that since we could not do servile work, gathering was most certainly forbidden. So even if man fell, they could not gather it. – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 22:09
  • @AleksandrSigalov Shemot 16:26 mentioned the Shabbat that happened to occur on the day when Manna didn't fall. It doesn't say all Shabbats have that property. Read the words. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 22:14
  • I already explained to you above why all miqra qodesh do not have man on them. What you saying is not logical interpretation of the text. – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 22:16
  • @DoubleAA FWIW, thre is a MY question (have to find it, if I can) that answers if Man fell on Yom Tov. It may assist with answering this question. I'm out for now, as I really don't understand the focus or what a "lunar Shabbat" means. Is that the OP's term for what we call "Rosh Hodesh"? What am I missing within the comments, here? – DanF Jan 25 '16 at 22:17
  • @DanF I already linked to it above. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 22:18
  • @DanF Shabbat was on April 19 and Passover 2008 was on 20. They both Shabbats. How we can have two shabbats? – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 22:23
  • FYI, prior to the current fixed calendar, two Shabbat's did exist, namely when Yom Kippur was either on Fri. or Sunday. I have to find a better answer as to why the term "Shabbat" doesn't apply in the same manner to the other holidays. Either way, as the blow answer states, the calendar during the time of the mahn is not what we currently use. – DanF Jan 25 '16 at 22:34
  • @DanF So how can we go back to it? Its the proper calendar after all... – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 22:35
  • I won't argue that point that it is the proper calendar, and when Sanhedrin becomes re-established when the next Temple gets rebuilt, we will return to that calendar, I suppose. Although, the reason as to why stipulations were made to assure that Yom Kippur does not occur on Fri. or Sun. (mentioned in Talmud Rosh Hashanna, I think about daf 20a), may still be there even with a "return" to the "original lunar calendar. – DanF Jan 25 '16 at 22:40
  • @AleksandrSigalov No, what you saying is not logical interpretation of the text. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 23:20
  • @DoubleAA Have you seen my calendar? – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 23:27
  • 4
    @AleksandrSigalov No and I don't plan on wasting my time doing so anytime soon. I spend too much time as it is pointing out the problems in what you say for the public good. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 23:30
  • 1
    Please edit to clarify the focus per the comments, especially the very first one. Once you do so the question will be review for possible reopening. – Monica Cellio Jan 26 '16 at 00:08

1 Answers1

4

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "correct" but if you're asking how the Jews wandering in the desert could have used the calendar we use today, the answer is, "they didn't" (although your confused reasoning about "two Shabbats" is irrelevant to that fact). Before the current calendar was developed in post-Temple times, a completely different calendar system was used which was based on observations of the moon.

Daniel
  • 24,888
  • 3
  • 48
  • 148
  • I think he's calling a calendar with "Lunar Shabbatot" the "traditional calendar". (ie shabbat on 8/15/22/29 of the month) If I were you I'd vote to close as unclear. – Double AA Jan 25 '16 at 21:58
  • @DoubleAA No, I am talking about our calendar. Not Lunar Shabbat one. But I do imply it as a solution. – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 25 '16 at 22:01
  • I accepted this answer but it is still not clear to me what we can do and when. I want to live by proper calendar. – Aleksandr Sigalov Jan 26 '16 at 00:09
  • 1
    The "proper" calendar is the one we are currently using, not anyone else's proposed calendar, not yours, not the Gregorian, Hindu or any other. Does the current Judaic calendar have flaws? Absolutely! There are many articles that explain the "seasonal drift" showing that if left as is, Pesach could fall in the winter in a few thousand years, unless our calendar gets adjusted. That's not the point, here. You and I won't be alive to worry about what happens, then, anyway. For now, our calendar has been exceptionally good for a few millennium. I don't think you'd do better than Hillel IV. – DanF Jan 26 '16 at 14:39
  • @DanF Hillel II, IIRC. – Scimonster Jan 26 '16 at 20:43
  • @Scimonster Thanks for the correction. As I age, I guess my ability to add things up decreases :-) – DanF Jan 26 '16 at 21:09