Can I fold my neighbour’s tallis if I find it in Shul unfolded a day or more after Shabbos?

Question

Related to Can you fold a tallis on Shabbos?

Folding one’s tallis after Shabbos is a seguloh for Sholom Bayis (unfolding a dish towel and helping one’s wife after Shabbos is a bigger seguloh according to Rabbi Zev Greenglas of Montreal, alav hashalom).

If I find my neighbour’s tallis in Shul unfolded (say on Sunday afternoon or later in the week) is there anything wrong in my folding it for him?

Am I interfering with his Sholom Bayis

or

Would his wife be pleased if she knew that his tallis which she may have bought for him had been folded (even by someone else)?

Given the reasoning in your first link, it should just depend what the wife wants... — Double AA, Dec 22 '13 at 21:02
The idea that helping one's wife on motzei Shabbat is a segulah for shalom bayit seems odd to me --- its efficacy seems to be of a very "revealed" kind :-) — Shivaram Lingamneni, Dec 23 '13 at 04:14
This link questions the assumption that folding a talis is for Shalom Bayis http://havolim.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/vayeira-bereishis-1813-shalom-bayis-and.html — eramm, Dec 23 '13 at 13:00
Your answer depends in part on how the segula works. Is the segula that the husband folds the talis himself or is the segula that the talis should be in a folded state. — eramm, Dec 23 '13 at 13:03

score 3 · Answer 1 · edited Dec 25 '13 at 23:02

3

Yes. You can fold his tallis.

Folding your neighbors tallis will protect it from damage. Forget about segulah. You have an obligation to protect your neighbors property, particularly when it costs you nothing to do so!

Here is a source for the obligation to protect others' property Aruch Hashulchan, Choshen Mishpat 259:17 – One must try to prevent any type of loss to another person. (see link. go to case 4) http://nleresources.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/02/Hashavat-Aveidah-to-web-Jan-24-2013-.pdf –

If you must bring shalom bayis into it, if the man's tallis gets damaged, won't the wife be angry?

edited Dec 25 '13 at 23:02

Double AA

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answered Dec 22 '13 at 18:47

Clint Eastwood

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Won't folding a talis stress the fold lines, thereby tending to tear them? What damage does it protect the talis from? 2) Whence "You have an obligation to protect your neighbors property", please?

msh210

Dec 23 '13 at 06:13

1

while folding a garment will put a stress on the crease lines, it will prevent potential damage to the delicate tzitzit and make it less likely to slip on the floor .

2)The obligation to protect others property should be derivable from the obligation to return lost property. 3) One can go further and say since the tallis is a holy object, it is a chillul hashem for it to be left in dissarray.

– Clint Eastwood Dec 23 '13 at 14:18

score 3 · Answer 2 · edited Dec 23 '13 at 12:10

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This is an interesting question because there is the Shalom Bayis reason(from the Tamei Minhagim) and also the Magen Avraham who brings the Mahril who folded his talis motzei shabbas.

However, the Ben Ish Chai parshas Noach 16 writes that one should be careful not to leave his talis unfolded overnight(which seems one can fold his fellows talis) but he then brings that one should fold his own talis instead of someone else because it can be a detriment to the owners mazal(seems like one shouldn't fold his fellows talis)

16:אין נכון להניח הטלית בלא קפול בלילה, ואם שכח ולא קפלו ועבר עליו הלילה אז כשילבשנו למחר ינערינו תחלה וכנז' באחרונים, גם כתוב באחרונים שכל אדם יקפל טליתו כל יום אחר תפלה בידו ולא יתננו לשמש לקפלו דקשה למזל...

edited Dec 23 '13 at 12:10

Avrohom Yitzchok

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answered Dec 22 '13 at 18:58

sam

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Does this apply to communal tallasim? In my old synagogue congregants tended to just toss the tallasim on a table. Someone--including myself on ocassion--volunterred to fold the tallises and neatly place them in the cubicles setup for just such use. Does a person borrowing a tallis have the obligation to fold them and return to its proper place? – JJLL Dec 23 '13 at 12:51
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Communal talis is a diff story,it is fine to fold it since it is a kavod to the talis,since people sometimes neglect shul property – sam Dec 23 '13 at 16:43
Thanks Sam. People most certainly do neglect shul property. Unfortunately, some shuls neglect their own property too. You should have seen the condition of several of the tallisim I was referring to :( – JJLL Dec 23 '13 at 17:50

Can I fold my neighbour’s tallis if I find it in Shul unfolded a day or more after Shabbos?

2 Answers2