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According to the standard Shas print (Vilna Bavli), the order of Masechtas is Pesachim-Shekalim-Rosh Hashana-Yoma-Sukka-Beitza. This makes (some) sense as this is the order of holidays.

However, the Bavli Daf Yomi schedule is Pesachim-Shekalim-Yoma-Sukkah-Beitza-Rosh Hashana-Taanis. I note Daf Yomi was instituted after the Vilna print.

Why is there a discrepancy in the order?

Double AA
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ertert3terte
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    The Daf Yomi's order is the order found in Mishna/Tosefta. In fact your real question is why the Vilna printers messed with the order. I'm guessing it had to do with size constraints on different Masechtot being in one volume. – Double AA Oct 20 '13 at 21:23
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    Note also that the Vilna edition is based almost entirely on Bomberg's edition. – Double AA Oct 20 '13 at 21:41
  • @DoubleAA all the more so – ertert3terte Oct 20 '13 at 21:45
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    Or the less so. Bomberg wasn't Jewish. – Double AA Oct 20 '13 at 21:47
  • @DoubleAA but it's traditional – ertert3terte Oct 20 '13 at 23:24
  • Is it? Perhaps he changed it from the tradition and you never knew. All we know right now is the Rambam lists the Mishna in a different order than how it is ordered in a printed edition centuries later by a poor couple following a non-Jew's lead. Doesn't sound so traditional from that. – Double AA Oct 20 '13 at 23:25
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    There is no order to the masekhtos, there is only differing convention as regards how to print them. In reality, every mishna coexists simultaneously; it's all part of one system. It doesn't "begin" anywhere and it certainly never ends. To truly understand any one mishna you need to have learnt the entire Mishna, but to print the mishnayot onto physical paper you require an order of some sort. I wouldn't read too much into what that order is; ultimately, it doesn't matter. – Shimon bM Oct 21 '13 at 01:50
  • @DoubleAA traditional as in "conventional". Daf number is also conventional (no Rishon references daf numbers) yet it's "Daf Yomi". As Daf Yomi was invented long into convention, it's strange that he would change the order (unless it was dafka, which would be an interesting Ho'orah) – ertert3terte Oct 21 '13 at 02:19
  • @ShimonbM You can say that it's trivia (history) question... See my response to DoubleAA above. – ertert3terte Oct 21 '13 at 02:20
  • @ShmuelBrin Very well. One must be careful with that word ("tradition") around here as it can have multiple technical meanings. – Double AA Oct 21 '13 at 04:23
  • @DoubleAA Many times convention becomes tradition. – ertert3terte Oct 21 '13 at 04:24
  • @ShmuelBrin And many times not. It's the responsibility of those who know better to help determine what is a meaningful and useful tradition and what is people being scared to change (which is the appropriate initial response for those who don't know better). – Double AA Oct 21 '13 at 04:26
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    @ShimonbM מכדי תנא מנזיר סליק מאי תנא דקא תנא סוטה כדרבי דתניא רבי אומר למה נסמכה פרשת נזיר לפרשת סוטה לומר לך שכל הרואה סוטה בקלקולה יזיר עצמו מן היין וליתני סוטה והדר ליתני נזיר איידי דתנא כתובות ותנא המדיר תנא נדרים ואיידי דתנא נדרים תנא נזיר דדמי לנדרים וקתני סוטה כדרבי – ertert3terte Aug 22 '14 at 17:08
  • Related: https://judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/88014/is-the-number-of-chapters-per-tractate-relevant – Alex Apr 04 '18 at 00:46

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I don't think @Shimon bM's comment that order doesn't matter is justified. The Rishonim speak at length about the reasons for the order of the Masechtos (see Tosfos beginning of Bava Metzia and Avodah Zarah for example, and the Rambam's intro to the Mishnah etc. etc.). The Gemara even discusses whether the order bears Halachic repercussions (Bava Kama 102a, Avodah Zarah 7a).

@DoubleAA is correct that the real question is why the printers of the Shas changed the order, since it is clear that the 'true' order is the order of the Mishnah (& Tosefta and Rambam etc.). His suggestion that it had to do with size considerations is hard to swallow. RH and Beitzah have the same number of Dapim, why should printers have preferred grouping Yoma-Sukkah-Beitzah to grouping Rosh Hashanah-Yoma-Sukkah? It seems more likely that the theme of Tishrei Chagim seemed more logical for them (and for those who want to study the current holiday and will find it easier to find all of Tishrei in a single vol.)

The big question is still what determined the 'true' order of the Masechtos, and why Beitzah precedes Rosh Hashanah. I saw a fascinating reference regarding the 'true' order (i.e. which is more correct) of Masechtos at https://dafyomi.co.il/yoma/yo-in-biblio.htm . (It is worth becoming familiar with that site - there are answers and information there for everything related to Talmud and Mishnah.) In brief, they cite Rav R. Margoliyos (Yesod ha'Mishnah va'Arichasah) who points out that in every Seder, the order of the Masechtos is from larger to smaller - not in number of Dapim, but in number of Perakim. If so, it follows that the 'true' order must be Yoma, Sukah, Beitzah, RH (8,5,5,4 Perakim)!

This theme follows through the entire Shas with a single exception - the beginning of Zeraim (where the Masechtos reduce in size from Berachos to PEah to Demai (9,8,7), but jump up with Kilayim Shevi'is Terumos (9,10,11) before returning to the normal pattern with Ma'asros etc. (5,4,4,3,3). Since no simple answer has yet been suggested for that anomaly, the Rambam is justified in suggested his (sometimes forced) reasons for why each Maseches follows the previous one!

DAF
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  • Relevant Reid Bite from yesterday https://app.lakewooddafyomi.com/browse/listen?type=other&id=237870001 – Eliyahu Feb 12 '24 at 23:16