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How do segulas work? For example, according to the Zohar, one who reads the Ketores daily will get all sorts of berachos in his financial areas and will become wealthy.

Yet the amount of money one is supposed to make was pre-decreed by God on rosh hashana.

So it seems Segulas are able to add to what was pre-decreed? Can anyone clarify this difficulty?

(I'm asking in a general way especially in financial matters. The whole concept seems to contradict the shaar bitachon, which says to trust God in financial matters and realize that "means are all the same to God and nothing you do will add or subtract in the least")

ray
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    Related: http://judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/22498/how-why-do-amulets-work – Isaac Moses Jan 29 '13 at 18:52
  • Also related: http://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/17209 – msh210 Jan 29 '13 at 19:14
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    Well asked. The question has always troubled me too. BTW Joseph Karo (1488-1575), author of the Shulkhan Arukh, possessed a maggid that identified itself as the voice of the Mishnah and of the Shekhinah. I was once told that for this reason keeping the Shulchan Oruch was a very powerfeul segulah!! – Avrohom Yitzchok Jan 29 '13 at 20:17
  • What about "עשר בשביל שתתעשר", which is one (the only?) thing in which we are actually allowed to test G-d? (Taanis 9a) – HodofHod Feb 01 '13 at 08:37
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    Not to be a party popper, but what is your evidence that segulas work. Setting aside the fact that many of them are completely made up and not back by any source, all the others come from a time of superstitions and mysticism. In the pragmatic realistic Judaism we keep today, there is no place for segulas which were for all terms and purposes just things too keep people at ease and help the faith. In my eyes it is sacrilege to believe in such superstitions seeing as we do not believe miracles still happen and we do not have a sage worthy of making them happen. – Yaakov Pinsky Feb 01 '13 at 09:36
  • continued: Those who give out these seguals are misguided and and misguided at best, while some of them are sown write sinners, lying in the name of god, baring false witness or calling up the Ov, whichever sin fancy's you the most.

    At the very best, one may say that modern day segulas are no more than a way (though misguided) to feel closer to god, feel better at you predicament etc. Believing the segual will help you, among other things contradicts in the way you mentioned, ad therefor it is a problem in bitachon and maybe also in believing an the one god and in his omnipotentcy.

     – Yaakov Pinsky Feb 01 '13 at 09:41
  • @YaakovPinsky Who's "we"? – Double AA Feb 01 '13 at 14:46
  • @HodofHod Ma'aser is a Mitzva DeOraita. Reading the Ketoret is not. I agree the OP is not clear exactly what he is calling a 'segulah' for the purposes of this question. Furthermore, the Gemara there explicitly says that Ma'aser is the only thing one can do this with, and has to bother to prove it from a Pasuk in Nach. – Double AA Feb 01 '13 at 15:09
  • @DoubleAA the gemarah says that this is the only thing one can test God with, not that it is the only thing one can do and expect a positive result. –  Feb 01 '13 at 15:14
  • @nikmasi What's the difference? Expecting a specific result from God for a specific action is testing Him to see if He does what He is 'supposed' to (whatever that means). – Double AA Feb 01 '13 at 15:15
  • @DoubleAA difference is if I tell you something works often versus something that is guaranteed to work (tzedaka is the latter) –  Feb 01 '13 at 16:15
  • @DoubleAA My comment was response to OP's last paragraph. – HodofHod Feb 01 '13 at 18:12
  • What's the difference between a Segula and a prayer? Just as Segulos fit into that Gemara in Rosh Hashana, prayer should also. – Hacham Gabriel Feb 04 '13 at 19:31
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    @HachamGabriel When I pray, I hope God answers me. When I separate Ma'aser, I expect God to answer me. – Double AA Feb 08 '13 at 07:30
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    See “Segula”: Empty Promises from Mesora.org. –  Mar 20 '13 at 17:23
  • @AvrohomYitzchok An even better segula is keeping a sefer Torah! Bava Kamma (87b): מאי סגולה רב חסדא אמר ספר תורה. (Disclaimer: The preceding is Purim Torah). – Fred Nov 26 '13 at 05:39
  • Are you only asking according to the opinions that believe in segulot, or also according to those that don't? Remember to always include all clarifications in the post itself. – mevaqesh Feb 05 '17 at 08:48
  • "I'm asking in a general way especially in financial matters. The whole concept seems to contradict the shaar bitachon" Do you have any reason to assume the Hovot HaLevavot believed in segulot? It seems like you are looking for a resolution of the unresolvable. – mevaqesh Apr 03 '17 at 17:06
  • The only segulos I believe in are the ones in the Gemara. See Horayos 12a and 13b with the cited Gemaras in the Artscroll footnotes. – DonielF Apr 03 '17 at 18:03
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    If you think everything is predetermined at Rosh HaShana (an idea you should source), then question isn't really about segulot; it is about why one should ever do anything to try to achieve an end, if the results are already predetermined. Consider editing to clarify how this is a question about segulot. – mevaqesh Apr 03 '17 at 20:38

5 Answers5

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Personally, I think that segulos are psychological aids. It's not that you bake a key in your challah and magically you somehow make more money. Rather, the baking of the key in the challah is supposed to be a symbolic gesture that will convey to you that all parnassah really comes from God. And once that becomes more clear to you, it will help your prayers, and your trust in God, and hence your observance of the mitzvos, which actually is a valid form of gaining this-worldly benefits (see Deut. 11:13).

Now, I will compare this concept to two other phenomena:

  1. Tzitzis. There is a commandment to wear tzitzis on every four-cornered garment with one string of techeles. Why? "וּרְאִיתֶם אֹתוֹ וּזְכַרְתֶּם אֶת-כָּל-מִצְו‍ֹת יְהוָה, וַעֲשִׂיתֶם אֹתָם" - "And you will see it and you will remember all the commandments of God, and you will do them". Somehow, wearing these strings will provide a reminder of God's commandments. They are somehow symbolic. They are a psychological aid. I like to think of segulos as extra-biblical tzitzis.
  2. Symbolism of the Prophets. We find this all the time. In order for a prophet to convey a certain message to the people, God would tell them to do something symbolic to help the people understand the message. Isaiah walked around naked and barefoot for days (or maybe years). Jeremiah harnessed himself to a yolk. Ezekiel laid on his side for hundreds of days, and then turned around onto his other side for a few more. Hoshea married a prostitute. Etc., etc. You get the point. Why did they do these things? Why didn't they just tell the people God's message? The answer is obvious. Sometimes you can read something or have something told to you over and over again. But when someone acts it out, when it happens in practice, that's when it really sinks in. Same here. You can read about God's hashgacha and hear lectures about it all day. But the symbolic gestures, when you do something active to show it, sometimes that's what it takes to sink in.

The consequence of this is that segulos only "work" if they are meaningful to you. If you do a segula because you lost a bet, or with skepticism or sarcasm, you're missing the point. You do a segula because you grasp the symbolism. If it's something that turns you off rather than being at all meaningful, it's counter-productive.

I'm not going to claim that this is how everyone has ever understood segulos. There will probably be statements across the vast ocean of Jewish literature that contradict this. Chida (for example) may not have understood segulos like this. But I think that this is a valid approach to them, and perhaps how many people have understood it.

jake
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Another possibility is that segulot work because they are ma'aseh Satan - the works of the evil inclination. Think of how ingenious the Satan is that he plies unsuspecting pious Jew with promises that by performing this seeming act of devotion he will be granted his wish. This person then abdicates the torah-mandated service of God, putting aside things like torah study time to pursue these smoke-and-mirrors.

UPDATE I have found a list of segulot which come from the torah or chazal and cannot be misconstrued as the work of the Satan

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Pretty sure they don't. I have tried several myself and without any statistical evidence that they do work, I wouldn't rely on anecdotes. Conceptually they also make no sense. Besides the problem you pointed out think about the message they convey: You don't have to be a good person necessarily, just do segulah X and God will be forced to grant you something or other.

If in fact they do (or did) have any basis once upon a time I would assume it was related to other magical practices, you could say, for example that the gemarah's formula to see demons is a "segulah" for seeing demons.

Source: My own experience and logical conjecture.

UPDATE: To illustrate this point I undertook to read a special segulah version of the ketores (provided by the OP) for 40 days. After having successfully completed this experiment and having followed all the instructions provided I can report that I see not one scintilla of any improvement in my life in any way whatsoever. There has been no positive change in any of things I prayed for, either for the Jewish community or myself and my family. Thus I must conclude that segulas (or at least this one) are not efficacious at all and that any success one find by using them is merely coincidence or misperception.

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    How can you answer the question by saying segulos don't work if the questioner explicitly quoted the Zohar that said it does work (albeit without a specific location given)? – b a Feb 01 '13 at 17:59
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    @ba either a) the zohar is wrong, b)the segual used to work but no longer does (as I mention in paragraph 2) or c)the zohar means something else, but without the source that would be hard to know. My $ is on b. –  Feb 01 '13 at 18:11
  • Do you have any reason to believe something changed? We certainly no longer have pairs, etc., but it seems unlikely for any single thing to no longer work. – b a Feb 01 '13 at 18:43
  • thank you for the answer but the plain meaning is that segulas work. it's not just the zohar. segulas all over the place in the talmud and all the way up to the chumash in parsha vayetze with the dudaim of Rachel who was a prophetess. To say that it's all just balony and a placebo effect without any source besides personal experience is hard to swallow – ray Feb 02 '13 at 18:05
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    @R.Sebag Talmud I grant you, but Rachel (who is not one of the 7 prophetesses) ate some fruit. No mention of segullah there. – Double AA Feb 03 '13 at 23:42
  • wrong. see the Ramban commentary on the dudaim who says the dudaim work not through natural means but "derech segulah" – ray Feb 04 '13 at 10:10
  • @R.Sebag, b a 1) Go try some yourself. If they don't work, how do you explain it? 2)There are plenty of cures in the gemarah that no longer work, if we can say nishtanu hatevah for those why not segulas? 3)regarding the dudaim A)they don't work anymore and B) neither do any other segulah found in the chumash (putting striped sticks in front of cattle doesn't determine their phenotype). Ergo, we are left with a choice either segulas never worked (there is no proof that Reuvain's dudaim would have done anything) or they used to work and something changed. –  Feb 04 '13 at 14:28
  • @nikmasi - wrong. I have been saying a special ketores reading recommended to me by a mekubal and have found a new beracha in my financial situation. so from my experience, the zohar is correct. I think you have to say that the segulas are a form of hishtadlus. you can have natural hishtadlus like working to make money or segula hishtadlus like reading ketores. I think this was the intent of the Ramban in explaining the dudaim of Rachel and the answer to this question. – ray Feb 04 '13 at 20:39
  • @R.Sebag I'm not sure I understand you. Do they work or don't they? If they don't work every time then your example is a statistical anomaly/fluke and proves nothing. Are you saying work is a segulah for parnasa? If you truly believe that reading ketores will pay the bills I double dare you to stop working on just read ketores all day. I'm sure there are hundreds of people who have tried segulot for things like having kids, but it hasn't worked. Does that mean they're just not trying hard enough?! –  Feb 04 '13 at 21:00
  • segula does not mean it works every time, otherwise it would contradict the shaar bitachon. everything is from God. work also is just hishtadlus. no guarantee. likewise segula is a form of hishtadlus. – ray Feb 04 '13 at 21:20
  • @R.Sebag that's not what the Zohar you (semi)quote in the question says though. A segulah is by definition something you do which has an effect that is not apparently connected to what you did. Why should reading the ketores bring you parnasah? Because if you brought the ketores in the mikdash it would? Are you a kohen? Are you tomei? Hishtadlus is the opposite. You do thing X whose natural, normal outcome is thing Y. Why did thing Y happen? Because of God, but you did your hishtadlus. Davening 40 days at the kotel doesn't make me a good eved Hashem, so why should he listen to my tefillot? –  Feb 04 '13 at 21:45
  • yes segulas are bizare. doesnt make you a better person. I agree 100%. that's part of the reason why I don't understand how they work. but the fact that they work is all over the talmud. maybe it's a hishtadlut in spiritual forces, unlike work or health which is hishtadlut in physical forces – ray Feb 05 '13 at 19:02
  • I'm not a mekubal (though I play one on tv) but I'm pretty sure hishtadlus through spiritual forces are called mitzvos. Weird health cures are all over the gemarah too, doesn't mean they work any longer. –  Feb 05 '13 at 20:01
  • yes, but the spiritual system underlying the physical laws should still be there, even though there's more "hester panim" today then there was b4. there's a whole world that we don't see with our physical eyes. gemora says shedim/mazikim are all around us. This may sound nuts but I have a 9 year old son who was born an absolute devil. tried just about every possible treatment but the kid just got worse and worse. – ray Feb 05 '13 at 22:37
  • continued. I then took him to a kosher mekubal who told me that "mazikim are constantly trying to take him out of the kedusha", and prescribed a special kamea. Lo and behold, the kid was immediately different and continued so for past 2 years. the kid himself tells me he feels something weird when the kamea is on him. if i put a tiny chatzitza on it, no longer works. take it off, it works again. the kid doesnt know what is a chatzitza, so I highly doubt this is placebo. – ray Feb 05 '13 at 22:40
  • @R.Sebag I don't think you can collapse kameot and segulot, but even if you can, as I said before one example does not a rule make. If hundreds, or thousands of people have tried many segulot over the years, only to have them fail how can that be explained? I'll do you one better. If you can cite the zohar about the ketores I will try the segulah myself and we'll see how it works. –  Feb 06 '13 at 15:06
  • this is the one i used: http://dafyomireview.com/article.php?docid=371 . you'd need to read it daily for at least a month for an honest trial. the zohar is on vayakhel daf 218 googling, i found this:http://www.yeshiva.org.il/ask/?id=56436 let me know how it worked – ray Feb 06 '13 at 19:08
  • Moshe rabeinu was given the segula of ketores and used it to stop the plague in parsha pinchas. this is documented in the chumash. and how can you know segulas dont work anymore? this would require a statistical study. not to mention like u pointed out, there are lots of whacko fake mekubals giving all sorts of trash and labeling it segulas – ray Feb 06 '13 at 19:16
  • @R.Sebag any other qualifications? Do I need to read it at night or day, sitting or standing? I want to make sure this is a legit trial –  Feb 06 '13 at 19:59
  • NOT at night unless after chatzot. shabbos ok at night. all names in parentheses must not be said nor even said in mind. just looked at. instructions are there. somethings are said 7 times, some are 3 times. what is said 7 times if too hard, then say it once. but the stuff that is 3 times must be 3 times. this is what i was told. let me knowif u have questions and your results rsebag at yahoo com. keep in mind though, there may be stuff blocking. when i went to the mekubal he "saw" some kind of tuma attached to me due to college days problem and told me do a gilgul sheleg first to remove it. – ray Feb 07 '13 at 07:18
  • try it anyway. at least if you see a new beracha you will know – ray Feb 07 '13 at 07:19
  • @R.Sebag Day one, so far so good. I even the v'yehi noam/yoshev b'seter 7 times. had to do it sitting (commute to work). I'm sure I've got a lot of tumah from my younger years, but I'm not rolling around naked in the snow (did you really do that?!). I'll keep you posted. –  Feb 07 '13 at 14:08
  • @nikmasi Any updates? – Double AA Mar 03 '13 at 16:55
  • @DoubleAA I am proud to say I haven't missed a day yet (although I came close twice). So far no change parnasa wise, or really in any other way that I can discern. I plan to continue through the 20th of March which should be 40 full days. I'll post again at that point. I am also, to the best of my ability, trying to do teshuva so that my aveiros won't prevent any extra special shefa that may come from shomayim. –  Mar 04 '13 at 14:30
  • may be better to keep it quiet as the talmud says "bracha is only found in something not revealed to the eye". I know several people who did this. most saw a new bracha within 2 weeks. i myself saw big changes in parnasa. remember to daven at the end for something of kavod shamayim (such as better learning) not for money. – ray Mar 07 '13 at 21:04
  • @R.Sebag But you yourself have stated that it worked for you, thus revealing it to the eye. When I get to the part that says to insert personal requests I first request that Moshiach should come. Then I make requests for specific people I know who either need some form of yeshua or shidduch then I ask for health and wellbeing for my family. Sometimes I ask for increased parnasa other times not. –  Mar 07 '13 at 21:39
  • yes it worked but i didn't ask for parnasa in the end. it just happened by itself. my experience is that i get tangible results when praying for spiritual things. but for other things like my knee problem - nothing. BTW, the ketores is also a segula for teshuva!! so you may unwittingly have seen results right under your nose – ray Mar 08 '13 at 06:34
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    @R.Sebag it is now 40 days since I undertook to say the ketores, which by my own speculation is the most effort anyone has put in to answer a question on SE ever. After having followed all the instructions provided I can report that I see not one scintilla of any improvement in my life in any way whatsoever. There has been no positive change in any of things I prayed for, either for the Jewish community or myself and my family. Thus I must conclude that segulas (or at least this one) are not efficacious at all and that any success one find by using them is merely coincidence or misperception. –  Mar 20 '13 at 16:14
  • congratulations. but you cannot make a statistical study from one case. I have reason to believe it does work based on having seen several people who had positive effects. there may be other factors blocking things or maybe your derech is through a different type of hishtadlus. there are many factors involved. – ray Mar 20 '13 at 17:22
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    @R.Sebag "you cannot make a statistical study from one case" ??? You're entire premise is based on the few cases you have seen where the person seems to have had clairvoyant powers! Is that also not statistical enough? – Double AA Mar 20 '13 at 17:36
  • @R.Sebag I was expecting these kinds of excuses as to why it didn't work, the reason I pursued this was to hopefully show anyone who believes in segulot that their efforts are misguided. Believe me, I very much wanted it to work. The truth is if segulot are not guaranteed to work no matter and can fail for any number of reasons what good are they? And how do you know that they worked for you? Luckily there is a sure-fire way to get in Gods good graces, following all of his commandments. There are no shortcuts. –  Mar 20 '13 at 17:48
  • http://judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/20376/guaranteed-olam-haba#comment48036_20376 – Fred Nov 26 '13 at 05:31
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I think the segulas are a form of hishtadlut (efforts) in spiritual forces.

One can do hishtadlut using physical means such as going to a doctor and taking medicine. Or one can try using spiritual means. The physical world has underlying spiritual forces which determine what happens. I once read in a book on Rabbi Kaduri that it took him years to find the name of the malach appointed on cancer. He needed this to write kameas.

As for the ketores, the Arizal in Pri Etz Chaim 115 writes a logical explanation based on mystical phenomena that the 11 incenses ascend the 10 sefiros of kedusha from the klipot. see there. The klipos "intercept" shefa (spiritual flow) and therefore by neutralizing some of them more shefa reaches a person and he should get richer, be easier to do teshuva, etc.. All this is just hishtadlut though and as in physical means, there's no guarantee that it will work.

ray
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  • Did you perhaps mean "raise" (a transitive verb) when you wrote "ascend"? – msh210 Mar 07 '13 at 22:14
  • dunno the difference. the point is that it raises/ascends the lifeforce of the klipos thereby neutralizing them. see the source. – ray Mar 08 '13 at 06:36
  • why the downvote? seems to me this site is biased against any kind of mystical sources. just reminder that one who denies the authority of the zohar and the like should be regarded as an apikorus http://www.rabbileff.net/shiurim/answers/1000-1249/1106.mp3 – ray Mar 10 '13 at 18:27
  • I can't speak for the downvoter, but suspect there may have been other reasons for the downvote. Re your final claim, though, see http://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/23303. – msh210 Mar 10 '13 at 20:01
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    http://www.rabbileff.net/shiurim/answers/1750-1999/1776.mp3 – Double AA Mar 20 '13 at 16:24
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    @DoubleAA halacha is like the majority. and certainly the vast vast majority. – ray Mar 24 '13 at 13:15
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    Interesting that minority opinions can't ever exist by this logic. Certainly the vast vast majority of cases demonstrate that minority opinions can exist. – Double AA Mar 24 '13 at 14:09
  • How does any of this answer the question? How does the mechanism of "mystical phenomena that the 11 incenses ascend the 10 sefiros of kedusha from the klipot" answer the question? The question was why the idea of a segulah isn't a contradiction to predetermination. That hasn't been answered. – mevaqesh Apr 03 '17 at 20:41
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I have followed the segulot, they really do work. I have faith, but they act alone because of the PSALM 91 says:

91:1 O thou that dwellest in the covert of the Most High, and abidest in the shadow of the Almighty;

91:2 I will say of the Lord, who is my refuge and my fortress, my God, in whom I trust...

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