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What is the most accurate English translation of the famous verse from Tehillim (Psalms)

פתחו לי שערי צדק

?

CodyBugstein
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    http://www.mechon-mamre.org/p/pt/pt26b8.htm#19 – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 04:12
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    I'm not sure there is such a thing as the proper translation. – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 04:14
  • @DoubleAA I edited the way I phrased it. – CodyBugstein Jan 17 '13 at 04:15
  • Imray, even so "There are seventy facets of Torah" (Bamidbar Rabbah 13:15) which are all legitimate interpretations – Michoel Jan 17 '13 at 05:00
  • @Michoel Translation != Interpretation. – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 05:14
  • @DoubleAA http://judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/13392/hebrew-to-english-translations-of-daniel-923-27#comment22604_13392 – b a Jan 17 '13 at 05:16
  • @ba Yesh Lechalek between the most perplexing passage in Daniyel and 4 words of basically modern Hebrew. – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 05:21
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    @DoubleAA Hard (if not impossible) to translate Torah without applying any interpretation. – Michoel Jan 17 '13 at 07:10
  • @Michoel But some are closer than others. (Yours was essentially ba's point above.) – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 07:12
  • @DoubleAA I agree translation != interpretation, but being that different interpretation will most often = different translation, and both are legitimate Torah interpretations, I don't think it is generally possible for there to be a "most accurate translation". – Michoel Jan 17 '13 at 07:44
  • @Michoel Like I said, some are closer than others. Maybe there will be a few which are all equally close. But there will always be many which are not. Many interpretations will purposefully use non-literal translations and that is fine, but I wouldn't say (and I don't think they would say) they represent the accurate translations; just useful interpretations. – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 07:46
  • @DoubleAA Right, so I think we agree that there can be a few translations that are "equally close" and legitimate. Hence my point that there cannot be one translation considered "the most accurate". – Michoel Jan 17 '13 at 07:49
  • @Michoel I don't see where I claimed there was only one and I even criticized the original wording of the question. I do think that the number of valid substantively unique renderings is much less than 70, as you seemed to imply above. – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 07:59
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    @DoubleAA We are just nitpicking now.. (or maybe the whole time :-). You criticized the original wording, which was then edited. I pointed out that the edit did not remove the entire problem which I think you agree to. So granted you won't call all 70 interpretations "accurate translations", but my point remains that there is no one most accurate. – Michoel Jan 17 '13 at 08:04

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The verse literally means something like "Open (command, plural) for me the gates of righteousness." Rashi interprets it to mean the gates of the Beis HaMikdash. Metzudas David explains that he is going there to thank G-d for having rescued him (referred to in the previous verses). The Ibn Ezra says they are called the "gates of righteousness" because a person has an obligation to thank G-d for His help, which is what David is saying he is doing. Malbim says he was leading a sacrifice there to thank G-d and asking the gatekeepers to open the gates for him, and that they are called "gates of righteousness (or: judgment)" because G-d, having afflicted him in order to bring the salvation (as mentioned in the previous verse), had saved him more through judgment than through kindness. Radak interprets the gate thing to be a metaphor.

b a
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  • צדק sounds more literally like Justice. Also I don't see any definite article in the verse. – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 05:43
  • I wasn't making the translation exact to every word. I think the questioner was more interested in an explanation of what it means (what are the "gates of righteousness"?). – b a Jan 17 '13 at 05:54
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    ...but that's not what he wrote... (if anything he asked what are the "gates of Justice"; בצדק תשפוט עמיתך; צדק צדק תרדוף) – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 05:59
  • מאזני צדק אבני צדק איפת צדק הין צדק What did those objects do to become righteous? :) – Double AA Jan 17 '13 at 06:25
  • @DoubleAA Which is why I included the translation as well (though arguably not "the most exact"). (And who is this "right person"? They had Republicans back then? And what's this thing about "three hundred maidservants"?) – b a Jan 17 '13 at 06:28
  • If it was maidservants there wouldn't be a dagesh in the men. Also I don't know why right handed isn't a valid possible pshat in the verse, nor why you think that is more literal than benjaminite. – Double AA Feb 25 '13 at 04:57
  • @DoubleAA So replace it with three hundred arms (I assume you are referring to Rashi on Shemos, from which I received all the knowledge I know about dageshes in mems concerning the word אמה.) If you believe right-handed is a possible pshat, please explain how. I am not saying one is more literal than the other, but that words have meanings that depend on the context. – b a Feb 25 '13 at 05:26
  • I don't know what needs to be explained about it. Justice in this case is definitely more literal and the better meaning in context than righteousness, as is the case in every instance of צדק in the Tanach that I can find now (certainly in such an overwhelming majority that the burden is on you to prove that it isn't the case here). – Double AA Feb 25 '13 at 05:35
  • @DoubleAA It can be translated either way in many cases. Here is a search for every time the word "righteousness" appears in the JPS translation. You also surely can't deny that it is related to the word "צדיק." I chose the translation that is conventionally used in many cases. In fact, JPS (linked from your comment on the question) also chose "righteousness." – b a Feb 25 '13 at 05:43
  • If you claim to be just relying on convention and not trying to be precise, that's fine, but it is not what you claimed above, seemingly particularly when you wrote in your answer 'literally'. I said "Justice in this case is definitely more literal and the better meaning in context than righteousness, as is the case in every instance of צדק in the Tanach that I can find now" and JPS notwithstanding I stand by that. Please show me an instance (or a lot of instances, really) where righteousness is better. – Double AA Feb 25 '13 at 05:46
  • @DoubleAA "Literally means something like..." My main point was to explain the verse, not give a word for word translation. Notwithstanding, I never claimed that "righteousness" is "better," only that it's valid. – b a Feb 25 '13 at 06:05
  • I don't see then how this answers the question. – Double AA Feb 25 '13 at 15:57
  • @DoubleAA Just because my point in the answer wasn't to give a word for word translation doesn't mean that I didn't, just that it is secondary, since I guessed that the questioner wanted to understand what it meant. – b a Feb 25 '13 at 18:42
  • מניח העיקר ותופס הטפל. He asked for the "most accurate English translation" and you added in a definite article and reconstrued a word outside of its simple meaning, a difference which you yourself have to correct for in the Malbim's explanation, and a difference which completely changes the gist of Ibn Ezra's explanation. (All the other explanations you provide don't rely on the meaning of that word. In other words, you have a 100% fail rate at translating the word to accord with the explanations you quote.) – Double AA Feb 25 '13 at 18:47
  • @DoubleAA I fail to see how this impacts in any way the interpretation of the Ibn Ezra, and I fail to see how replacing "justice" with "righteousness" makes it work better for Malbim. – b a Feb 25 '13 at 18:49
  • It's much more powerful to state that thanking God is an act of justice than one of righteousness. The former is a basic tit-for-tat obligation, while the latter is beyond the letter of the law. And you yourself reinterpret righteousness as judgement for the Malbim. – Double AA Feb 25 '13 at 18:52
  • @DoubleAA 1. Google defines "righteousness" as "adhering to moral principles." 2. "Judgment," in my experience, is used more in connection with harsh judgment than justice is. – b a Feb 25 '13 at 18:57