If animals don't have freewill, why are dogs rewarded for not having barked at Jewish people during the Exodus from Egypt? (Exodus 11 and Exodus 22)
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2Why do you think animals don't have free will? – Double AA Jun 16 '19 at 16:27
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@RubinhoBrasil Positive reinforcement is a training technique to encourage particular behavior. It works with most creatures, even insects, reptiles & amphibians. It doesn’t involve free choice. That remains solely in the domain of human beings according to the Torah. – Yaacov Deane Jun 16 '19 at 16:33
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2Welcome to Mi Yodeya! Thank you for your question. We hope you stick around. – LN6595 Jun 16 '19 at 16:34
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@Yaacov Deane, what do you mean with positive reinforcement? Dogs didn't bakr at the Jews in Egypt and nowadyas in America we give them non-kosher meat. How is this positive reinforcement? – user5202 Jun 16 '19 at 16:39
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@RubinhoBrasil that is a very difficult question. Very few people have clarity on freewill and rashi doesn't comment anything on this passage, meaning, it will require someone who knows a commentary that explores it in a deep level... – user5202 Jun 16 '19 at 16:44
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@user5202 If I understand what the OP asked, he is confused about the nature of free choice. He associates ‘reward’ for an animal with reward and punishment as it relates to a Jew having free choice. They are not the same idea. Animals act according to the innate drives that G-d created them with. If you train them by via their innate drives, like a food reward, you can direct their behavior. Google ‘BF Skinner and positive reinforcement’ for details. Free choice is without compulsion and when ‘Tov’ & ‘Ra’ are equal before you. And then the human being expresses their will by choosing. – Yaacov Deane Jun 16 '19 at 17:57
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@user5202 That is where the expression of our Sages as expressed in Sefer Tov HaLevanon, 5th Treatise on Devotion. 5:251 comes from. You can see it on Sefaria. – Yaacov Deane Jun 16 '19 at 18:07
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Regarding your premise: https://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/27977/ – DonielF Jun 16 '19 at 19:19
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Related (dupe?): https://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/62474/ – DonielF Jun 16 '19 at 19:30
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1It is crucial to understand the nature of educational statements of our Sages. They don't reflect the absolute truth as you expect, instead, they educate us to see G-d's good attributes in many different situations. – Al Berko Jun 16 '19 at 21:38
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If this were about reward and punishment, we would be talking about those specific dogs living in Egypt that night. – Micha Berger Jun 17 '19 at 13:56
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Rabbi Shafier of The Shmuz asks this question in one of the pieces from Parshas Mishpatim.
The gist of his answer (although I'd recommend reading it directly, it's not too long of an article) is a two step answer: 1) all results come about from Hashem, even though a person puts intent into their actions, ultimately no results would come about from the actions if Hashem didn't will for the results to come about. 2) Nevertheless, Hashem set up the reward system to work in a way where a person gets rewarded for the good that comes about for their actions, even though the results were all from Hashem.
Tying that idea back to your question:
Through the animals a greater good was brought, and for that they deserve reward. Granted they didn’t intend it — they are animals — but through them came a good, and that is attributed to them. For that, they deserve reward.
Salmononius2
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Very good answer from Rabbi Shafier, thanks for pointing out ! But if his statement is true, why didn't the wild animals that brought the 4th plague to Egypt - bringing a massive kidush Hashem - were not rewarded ?! Why only the dogs ??? – user5202 Jun 17 '19 at 13:46
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@user5202 probobly they were rewadered (how do you know that only dogs?) – hazoriz Jun 17 '19 at 14:23
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Rabbi Shafier often quotes from Rabbi Avigdor Miller, so probably this idea comes from him. Somewhat similar is brought down in a Toras Avigdor Junior, which also uses his ideas: https://torasavigdor.org/wp-content/uploads/2024/01/TA-Junior-Bo-5784.pdf – Binyomin Feb 09 '24 at 10:03
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Free will and reward are not related,
for example, The Moon was punished for complaining.
It is just that G-d Almighty is just.
Is someone deserves good he should get it.
For example parents (even those that exploit their children) deserve respect.
Fruit Trees deserve respect (they should not be destroyed)
Animals deserve respect (even from non-jews) and meat separated from them while they were alive should not be eaten
