Do redpills have any feelings of remorse for killing innocent bluepills during their Matrix operations?

Question

In all three movies, we see how redpills don't mind killing innocent bluepills in order to achieve their goals, such as when

freeing Morpheus from the Agents, causing a mass accident during the freeway chase, or intruding into the club where the Merovingian is.

If a bluepill is possessed by an Agent, it's just a matter of self-defense, but when there are security men trying to stop redpills from entering a building, the redpills seem to shoot first and ask questions later. Bluepills are innocent humans, so do the redpills have any feelings of remorse whatsoever for murdering any bluepills in their way, or for being indifferent about endangering innocent bluepills?

According to the cinematographer, those security guards are projections — Valorum, Dec 04 '20 at 11:41
"Morpheus: No. It's another training program designed to teach you one thing. If you are not one of us, you are one of them.** — Valorum, Dec 04 '20 at 11:52
@Valorum Projections? Something like sentient programs? They clearly have an own will. — John, Dec 04 '20 at 11:55
https://scifi.stackexchange.com/a/81939/20774 - He called them "virtual constructs", presumably sentient below the level of a full Agent. — Valorum, Dec 04 '20 at 11:58
Related: What did Zion think would happen to the blue pills if they succeeded in destroying the Matrix?. In my answer to that question I have a quote/screenshot from Morpheus admitting that millions (actually billions) of blue pills would die if Zion succeeded in destroying the Matrix, so the remorse, if any, seems pretty minimal. — Null, Dec 04 '20 at 13:14
Does this answer your question? The Matrix: When Neo and Trinity shoot security/police are they actually killing real people? — Django Reinhardt, Dec 04 '20 at 16:01
@DjangoReinhardt No. I've assumed they are killing 'real' people and asking whether the redpills are feeling any remorse over this. Without the editor's statement it would be obvious they're bluepills, and the statement isn't confirmed so far. — John, Dec 04 '20 at 17:06
Trinity is sad about killing the Detective (Ash) in the Animatrix short: A Detective Story — Valorum, Dec 04 '20 at 21:03

Django Reinhardt · Accepted Answer · 2020-12-06T15:09:48.547

No, such concerns have never been vocalised in any of the Matrix films.

Some background. According to Morpheus, if you die in the Matrix, you die in "real" life:

Neo: [in pain] I thought it wasn't real.

Morpheus: Your mind makes it real.

Neo: If you're killed in the Matrix you die here?

Morpheus: The body cannot live without the mind.

Morpheus goes one step further and says that the innocents who live their lives, unaware that they are within The Matrix, are their enemy.

The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it.

It's even confirmed in the canonical comic, An Asset to the System, that these "blue-pills" are normal humans who are dying. A young security guard, with dreams of becoming a police officer, is shot by both an Agent and a "red-pill" and then we briefly see his dead body in reality.

However, despite this, according to Matrix film editor Zach Staenberg's DVD commentary, the guards you see in the iconic 'Lobby Scene' are in fact virtual constructs rather than real people:

"And one thing, the one thing that I find pretty interesting about this scene is that, um, nobody actually dies. That all these people are virtual. Which is the wild thing about this whole movie, that and is the stuff of, uh, great discussion and that is, if you're killing a computer construct then is it really violent at all? If it's just an amorphous computer simulation and a cathartic experience..."

There is some debate among fans if Staenberg's understanding is really the correct one.

Thanks to user Valorum for their research.

I don't think An Asset to the System is an especially good example here. The Zionese rebel has ample opportunity to kill the bluepill guard and doesn't do so. If anything that would suggest that efforts are made not to kill bluepills and that regret is expressed (or at least felt) when the need arises to neutralise them. — Valorum, Dec 05 '20 at 01:58
A better example would be Tosh and his crew in Day In ... Day Out, firing blindly into a crowd of bluepills in order to hinder some agents and make good their escape. — Valorum, Dec 05 '20 at 02:00

LogicDictates · Answer 2 · 2021-03-15T00:24:38.593

Morpheus alluded to his feelings about humans yet to be unplugged from the Matrix, during the "woman in the red dress" scene in the first film:

MORPHEUS: The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see; businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy.

A cop writing a parking ticket stares at Neo from behind his sunglasses.

MORPHEUS: You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged, and many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system that they will fight to protect it.

A beautiful woman in a red dress smiles at Neo as she passes by.

MORPHEUS: Were you listening to me, Neo? Or were you looking at the woman in the red dress?

NEO: I was...

MORPHEUS: Look again.

Neo turns just as Agent Smith levels a gun at his face.

MORPHEUS: Freeze it.

Everything except Morpheus and Neo freezes.

NEO: This... this isn't the Matrix?

MORPHEUS: No. It's another training program designed to teach you one thing; if you are not one of us, you're one of them.

NEO: What are they?

MORPHEUS: Sentient programs. They can move in and out of any software still hardwired to their system. That means that anyone that we haven't unplugged is potentially an Agent. Inside the Matrix, they are everyone and they are no one.

According to this, every human yet to be unplugged from the Matrix represents at least a potential threat, since they can be taken over by an Agent at any time. And even without being taken over by Agents, many of them are still "the enemy" on some level, since they help maintain -- and will actively fight to protect -- the system Morpheus and his crew are trying to bring down.

You can agree or disagree with Morpheus' logic, but either way, this appears to be his way of rationalising the killing and endangering of plugged-in humans as a justifiable means to the end he and his crew are striving for.

Note that Morpheus is not your typical red-pill. He's a religious nutbag. — Valorum, Dec 04 '20 at 21:43
@Valorum - That may be so; he certainly has more faith than most. But regardless of whether he's objectively a nutbag or not, the crucial thing is he doesn't seem to be perceived that way by most. On the contrary, he seems to be a highly influential figure, with many more supporters than critics. As such, what he says carries alot of weight among the population of unplugged humans. — LogicDictates, Dec 04 '20 at 22:01
Deadbolt thinks he's a loony. That he's right is merely the (annoying) icing on the cake. — Valorum, Dec 04 '20 at 22:07
@Valorum - Lock seems to be an isolated figure though, in regard to that particular viewpoint, and not nearly as well-liked in general as Morpheus. Cypher probably would've agreed with him, but everyone else seems to respect Morpheus, or at worst, is on the fence. — LogicDictates, Dec 04 '20 at 22:15
Your answer is good too, but Django (as well as Valorum in the comments) make it clear how indifferent the redpills are about the bluepills. — John, Dec 05 '20 at 10:00

Do redpills have any feelings of remorse for killing innocent bluepills during their Matrix operations?

2 Answers2