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Why Littlefinger bothered to kill Jon Arryn and assassinate Bran Stark?

Jon Arryn have already known too much about Lannisters' incest, so I would expect that he will be killed by Lannisters or someone else for sure.

Also why bother to kill Bran Stark and frame Lannisters when Lannisters would already have motive to kill Bran Stark and silence him for good? Wasn't Littlefinger's plot wasted to do it all by himself when it could be resolved in a way he wanted without his involvement anyway?

Sekhemty
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Polaris Sui Generis
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    Are you looking for answers from the books or the show? The answers could be very different.... – Skooba Sep 01 '17 at 15:41
  • Short answer: "Chaos is a ladder". Long answer: He gains Lannister support/trust and can probably gain more power by doing so. – TheLethalCarrot Sep 01 '17 at 15:43
  • Are you asking why bother going through with 2 plots to kill 2 people when the Lannisters would plan to kill both anyway? – RichS Sep 01 '17 at 15:43
  • Skooba 3 : Hmmm...I think I am open to everything as of now...Books are not written to the end and I think the story in TV is a bit ahead already. I am a TV Series watcher only, but it's OK to tell me also everything you want from books too. IF there is something that can spoil the story somehow AFTER Season 7 then please do not tell me if possible. – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 01 '17 at 15:44
  • When I watched the first 2 seasons, I got the impression that Littlefinger was secretly working for the Lannisters. He betrayed Ned Stark which is what Cersei wanted. He worked on the two plots you mentioned which is what Cersei wanted. It is only in a later season do we see Littlefinger working against the Lannisters and more for himself. Perhaps his work for the Lannisters was just one rung on the ladder to his own personal success. And the Lannisters might prefer to have Littlefinger do their dirty work so they don't get their own hands messy. – RichS Sep 01 '17 at 15:47
  • @RichS Well I understand that the plot is 1 as a whole including many actions. So in this case I ask why bother to perform 2 actions when there was not needed to do either of those under those circumstances. – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 01 '17 at 15:48
  • @RichS & TheLethalCoder Interesting point-of-view. I did not count that Lannisters could just hire Littlefinger to do the dirty work. But still he is a master of coin and I think that he is not the primary choice to ask him do the job... – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 01 '17 at 15:51
  • @PolarisSuiGeneris As far as I know they didn't ask him but he decided to himself to gain influence. Also by letting the Lannisters do it he has no control over the outcome and which way things will go. – TheLethalCarrot Sep 01 '17 at 15:52
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    Note to mods: Please don't close this question. This is a great question for understanding the motives of several characters. – RichS Sep 01 '17 at 15:53
  • Also, in the books Little finger wasn't responsible for the Bran attack. While it was his dagger, it had been given to the king and Joff sent it to be used by the assassin. Was there something I missed in the show where it was revealed LF sent it? – Paul Sep 01 '17 at 16:53
  • Littlefinger had no way to even KNOW about the Bran situation. The attack came while the King and co were still on the road back to Kings Landing. – The Evil Greebo Sep 01 '17 at 17:14
  • @RichS LF was always working for himself. They insinuate that he was the one who convinced Joffrey to kill Ned rather than send him to the wall. This was against what the Lannisters wanted. It actually turned out really bad for them. – Shane Sep 01 '17 at 21:10
  • I hate how our duplicates policy works, but this is a dupe because it's answered by answers in other questions. –  Sep 06 '17 at 16:42
  • @Axelord That answer doesn't answer if Petyr attempted to assassinate Bran, Which he didn't. Mayhaps we could request that the OP to edit his question to ask only about Bran. Since this has two questions, I'll be more inclined to VTC as too broad. – Aegon Sep 06 '17 at 16:59
  • @Aegon Unfortunately, a question specifically about Bran's assassination got closed as a dupe of the same question. I reposted my answer on the linked question to hopefully cover for that, but the original is pretty old. –  Sep 06 '17 at 17:18
  • @Axelord This one? It looked like the OP was asking if LF started the Wotfk, rather than if he had actually tried to murder bran. Which is why I thought it was a dupe. I have removed the redundant answer here. Which course do you suggest we should take? Leave this one open after editing the dupe bit? Reopen the closed question and close this one as dupe of that? Or close it as dupe of the one you chose as dupe target? – Aegon Sep 06 '17 at 17:25
  • @Aegon The dagger implication was its central question, which is of course bound to the assassination question. At any rate, I'm just going by the "oldest question gets credit" procedure. If you want to switch things around, I'm for it. –  Sep 06 '17 at 18:08
  • @Axelord I have VTC'd as Too-Broad as per This meta. Let me know if you disagree and maybe we could take it to Meta then? – Aegon Sep 07 '17 at 06:59
  • @Aegon Meh –  Sep 07 '17 at 19:33

5 Answers5

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Littlefinger thrives on chaos.

Littlefinger explains his motivations for everything he does to Sansa:

Whenever I consider a question, I ask myself ‘Will this action make this picture a reality,’ pull it out of my mind and into the world… and I only act if the answer is yes. A picture of me on the Iron Throne and you by my side.

Littlefinger tricked Lysa Arryn into poisoning Jon Arryn. He then sent a letter to Catelyn Stark, accusing the Lannisters. His goal here is clearly to get the Lannisters to fight the Starks. The same is true with the assassination attempt of Bran - he plants the idea in Catelyn's head that Tyrion is responsible. This leads directly to all the chaos that follows. And we know what Littlefinger thinks of chaos -

Chaos is a ladder. Many who try to climb it fail and never get to try again. The fall breaks them. And some, are given a chance to climb. They refuse, they cling to the realm or the gods or love. Illusions. Only the ladder is real. The climb is all there is.

Littlefinger had hoped to climb the ladder of chaos until he reached the top.

DKu
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  • +1. If the Lannisters did the deeds directly, they would sow seeds in a different direction. – Skooba Sep 01 '17 at 15:48
  • @ Skooba So basically he just wanted control and be sure that it will go that direction under Littlefinger directive? – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 01 '17 at 15:54
  • Littlefinger needs a level of control to make it work. The dagger he gives the assassin is key in his plot to turn Catelyn loose on Tyrion. This also causes confusion among the Lannisters, as they are also apparently unaware of the assassination attempt. In fact, in the books, Jaime admits to Catelyn that he pushed Bran out of the window, but says they decided not to try to assassinate him because it would be too difficult and he was probably going to die anyway. – DKu Sep 01 '17 at 16:10
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    @DKu Regarding Jamie & Cat: In that case I still think that it is such a huge risk to just hope he will die and not even try to kill him... – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 01 '17 at 16:17
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    I believe what Jaime says specifically is that they would have had to murder their way through half of Winterfell to get to Bran. Perhaps they preferred the idea of defending themselves against anything Bran may say (ie "he must be confused from the fall"), to the idea of being accused of infiltrating Winterfell in a direct assassination attempt. – DKu Sep 01 '17 at 16:49
  • 1st part of comment: I thank you all for your explanations. I understand that the whole plot was to make sure Lannister will fight with Stark. Without LF involvement there was a risk that everybody could think that Jon Arryn died under natural circumstances. This could still lead for Ned Stark to be "Hand of the King" to replace Jon Arryn anyway, however Lysa would not be involved to accuse Lannisters. Also Varys will find it difficult to find a way for Ned Stark to read the "genealogy book" (I presume that Varys also wants a conflict between Lannisters and Starks). – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 02 '17 at 10:37
  • 2nd part of comment: If I also take into the pool the assassination of Bran Stark, then I will try to be OK with Lannisters just not trying to kill him and LF involvement to make things sure that the conflict will happen in the end. – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 02 '17 at 10:39
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Littlefinger did need to be the one to get the wheels turning on this plot.

There is no evidence that Cersei were aware of Jon Arryn's investigation into her children. If Jon found enough proof then when to King Robert and was able to convince him of the treachery, Cersei would have been arrested on the spot. The reason Ned's plan fails later is that Robert is wounded on the boar hunt and Ned warns Cersei directly of his intents.

Littlefinger needed the plot to have the Starks and Lannisters at each other.

We know Littlefinger ultimate motive is "the Iron Throne with you [Sansa] by my side. To make this a possibility you need to have two things, 1) the Iron Throne be in contention, and 2) Sansa available for marriage. The Lannisters stand in the way of the throne and Starks (Ned in particular) stand in the way of Sansa. This discord is sowed by the letter Lysa writes to Caetlyn, and by falsely linking Tyrion to the assassination attempt of Bran. The attempt on Bran was not in his initial plan, but he seized the opportunity from the chaos.

But why Tyrion?

I think the reason Littlefinger chose to blame Tyrion is that he (Tyrion) was not in the capital at that time and was therefore vulnerable to arrest. It would have been nigh impossible to arrest a high ranking Lannister within a city they controlled. With Tyrion being in the North, it would have been a better chance to to find and arrest him there with the support of the other northern lords.

Skooba
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  • For me the sentence "What if Jon Arryn told someone" in S01E01 conversation between Cersei and Jamie is obvious that they knew something already... – Polaris Sui Generis Sep 01 '17 at 16:38
  • I think Cersei knew, which is why Pycelle didn't try to save Jon Arryn. She didn't ask him explicitly though (at least in the books). – Arnaud D. Sep 01 '17 at 17:04
  • Three things, 1) There is evidence in both books and show that Cersei was aware of the investigation. In the show, S1E1 has the conversation over Jon Arryn's body. In the books, Pycelle makes it clear that he felt Cersei knew but couldn't instruct him to let Jon Arryn die. 2) The ultimate motive of Sansa at his side came much later for Littlefinger. In fact meeting Sansa for the first time is one of the few times he loses his composure. It does seem like in the show, his plans get derailed - he swore in S1 he would never love, or let love dictate his plans – DariM Sep 04 '17 at 00:13
  • I'd actually be more inclined to say that the opposite holds true for laying the dagger at Tyrion's feet. Tyrion not being in the capital at the time makes it impossible to confront him. The Stark could more easily go confront Jaime, or Cersei, in the presence of the King, and that would unravel the lie because Robert would recognise the dagger etc. By involving Tyrion, he uses a despised character, who isn't there to confront, and who cannot refute his lie until much later. Tyrion only gets the chance to bring it up after he has been captured, Ned and Jaime already fought, damage done etc.
    • – DariM Sep 04 '17 at 00:16
  • Do you really think that marrying Sansa was his intent from the beginning? It seems to me like more of an impromptu decision after his plan with Lysa didn't work out, or at the most, she was his "Plan B". – Bradley Uffner Sep 05 '17 at 19:13