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The only way to destroy the Ring is by throwing it into the fire of Orodruin. This fact doesn't seem to be common knowledge and many people in the story (like Gimli) only learn about it at the council in Rivendell. How come Gandalf and Elrond know about this? And why are they so sure that it is the only way to destroy it? Taking the ring to Mordor means taking a great risk, so they must have been really confident that it is the only option. Where did they gain that knowledge?

quirmel
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    Because Gandalf has studied ringlore for decades and is quite literally the world's third greatest expert on them. – Valorum Aug 05 '17 at 15:37
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    IIRC, they knew that Orodruin was the only volcano whose fires were hot enough to melt the ring. If it was hot enough to forge the ring in the first place, they hoped (assumed?) it was still hot enough to destroy it. Incidentally, the movie shows the ring being cast, not forged, even though both books and movies say it was forged. – RichS Aug 05 '17 at 15:48
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    @Valorum Ok, I'll bite. Who were the other two great experts of the ring? Saruman (2nd) and of course Sauron (1st)? How about Elrond then? He was around for a long time... – Hans Olo Aug 05 '17 at 18:14
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    @Loki - Saruman was the greatest 'expert' in Ringlore. Sauron, presumably knows more about the rings of power than even Saruman since he made the One Ring and enchanted it. Celebrimbor would have been numero uno but dead men tell no tales. – Valorum Aug 05 '17 at 18:22
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    @RichS I'm pretty sure it had less to do with the heat of the fire and more to do with the mystic connection the ring had to the place of its making. – Paul Aug 05 '17 at 19:03
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    Dragon fire could not destroy the One Ring. – Ian Thompson Aug 06 '17 at 12:55
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    If I were to use the Joseph Campbell approach to analyzing a mythological story, one would have to pay attention to how things enter the story and how they leave. Usually if somebody enters a place by water, they also leave it by water. So perhaps this could be applied to if the ring entered by forging at mt.doom then it leaves via the same way. – Mallow Aug 06 '17 at 21:09
  • Aren't Gandalf and Elrond supposed to be much older than the others (like 100's of years, or immortal)? Why would it be surprising that they knew? – user13267 Aug 07 '17 at 01:11
  • @user13267 : Elrond is six or seven thousand years old. Saruman and Gandalf are (probably) older than the world, and entered Middle-Earth about two thousand years ago. – Anton Sherwood Aug 07 '17 at 06:51
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    @Valorum He was rather talkative in the video game Shadow of Mordor ;) – Jeroen Aug 07 '17 at 14:02
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    @Paul Iirc Tolkien notes in one of the Letters that in fact it is the heat too; and I want to say it's mentioned in HoME and certainly it's mentioned in The Shadow of the Past too; hot being keyword. But that doesn't necessarily negate whether it had something to do with the fact it was made there too. 'It has been said that dragon-fire could melt and consume the Rings of Power, but there is not now any dragon left on earth in which the old fire is hot enough; [...] not even Ancalagon the Black, who could have harmed the One Ring, the Ruling Ring, for that was made by Sauron himself.' – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:27
  • @user13267 Though 'immortal' isn't the same thing as we think of in this world. But elves can die - Glorfindel died during The Fall of Gondolin (along with the Balrog he slew) and was sent back i.e. same Glorfindel that helps Frodo in Fellowship. And although I can't remember her name or relation there is at least one elf who refused to live (and I do not refer to Arwen because she chose mortal life which she was allowed to do being Half-elven). But Elf immortality isn't the same thing as that of Valar (well maybe it is in a way; don't know but certainly the Elves envy Men and vice versa). – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:51
  • @IanThompson I'm pretty sure that it was mentioned that Smaug would have a firebreath powerful enough to melt the ring, if he was alive at the time. If there was another dragon of equivalent power alive, there is a good probability that it would be able to destroy the ring, too. – T. Sar Aug 07 '17 at 20:33
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    @RichS The fact it was forged just adds more questions. It takes less heat to forge than it does to cast. If they want to destroy the ring, they don't just want to turn it into a lump of metal that can be forged again. They want to completely melt and dissolve it. So if Orodruin's the only thing that's hot enough to forge it, how do they know it's hot enough to melt it? – 16807 Aug 07 '17 at 20:49
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    @T.Sar --- No, it wasn't. – Ian Thompson Aug 07 '17 at 21:25

6 Answers6

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Knowledge of how to destroy the Ring dates back to at least the end of the Second Age, after Isildur took the Ring, and as described in the chapter The Council of Elrond:

'Alas! yes,' said Elrond. 'Isildur took it, as should not have been. It should have been cast then into Orodruin's fire nigh at hand where it was made. But few marked what Isildur did. He alone stood by his father in that last mortal contest; and by Gil-galad only Círdan stood, and I. But Isildur would not listen to our counsel.'

It's notable that this occurred before Gandalf (or Saruman, for that matter) arrived in Middle-earth, and that Elrond and Círdan are (at that time) both Ringbearers: Elrond holding Vilya and Círdan Narya.

It may be assumed that Gandalf (and Saruman) received this information from either Elrond or Círdan (or both), and it must be concluded that this information therefore did not come from Ring research by any of the Istari, since it was clearly known before they arrived.

In Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age we read the following:

But the Elves were not so lightly to be caught. As soon as Sauron set the One Ring upon his finger they were aware of him; and they knew him, and perceived that he would be master of them, and of all that they wrought.

This seems the most likely source of the knowledge of where and how the One Ring must be destroyed. Otherwise it is not explicitly stated anywhere.

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    This answers how Gandalf learned of the ring's history from Elrond, but does not answer how anyone would know the only way to destroy the ring. Can you provide quotes from the books showing how they know of the one way to destroy the one ring? – RichS Aug 05 '17 at 18:46
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    If anyone knew, it would be Celembrimbor, and he presumably would have passed the information to (Galadriel and) Gil-galad, who in turn informed his lieutenants Elrond and Cirdan when he passed rings to them. – Buzz Aug 05 '17 at 22:01
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    You know you should REALLY merge your accounts. – Edlothiad Aug 05 '17 at 22:38
  • @Buzz: bonus points for Galadried in parenthesis :) – Teem Porary Aug 06 '17 at 05:47
  • @RichS --- I've tried to work out how Gandalf knew that casting the ring into the fires of Mount Doom was the only way to destroy it. It's too long for a comment, so I've posted an answer. However, I don't think a definitive answer exists. – Ian Thompson Aug 06 '17 at 12:58
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As Victim of Circumstance makes clear in his answer, the fact that the One Ring could be destroyed at Mount Doom was known to the elves at the end of the second age, and this information probably came from Celebrimbor. However, at the Council of Elrond, Elrond says

Gandalf has revealed to us that we cannot destroy it by any craft that we here possess.

So, the elves did not know that the ring could only be destroyed at Mount Doom. Only Gandalf seems to have known any more about the destruction of Rings of Power, and he knew a lot. Aside from pointing out that the Elves could not destroy the One (and that dragons destroyed four of the Seven), Gandalf rules out several other possibilites:

... he [Tom Bombadil] cannot alter the Ring itself.

(The Council of Elrond)

Not even the anvils and furnaces of the Dwarves could do that.

(The Shadow of the Past)

... nor was there ever any dragon, not even Ancalagon the Black, who could have harmed the One Ring, the Ruling Ring, for that was made by Sauron himself.

(The Shadow of the Past)

In fact, Gandalf states unequivocally that

There is only one way: to find the Cracks of Doom in the depths of Orodruin, the fire-mountain, and cast the Ring in there.

(The Shadow of the Past).

I think it's important to stress that Ancalagon (had he been alive) could not destroy the Ring because it was 'made by Sauron himself'. My own reading of this is that Gandalf knew destroying the ring without returning it to Mount Doom would require a power greater than Sauron's. How else could he have known that no other method would work, when none had been tried? However, as Gandalf himself puts it:

I knew much and I have learned much. But I am not going to give an account of all my doings to you.

Ian Thompson
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  • Perhaps all those methods were attempted and he read accounts of how they failed. – John Meacham Aug 06 '17 at 23:16
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    @JohnMeacham --- Aside from Sauron himself, the ring had two bearers before Bilbo: Isildur and Gollum. Neither of these looked for a way to destroy it. Also, Ancalagon was dead when the ring was created, so nobody could test whether he could destroy it. Nevertheless, Gandalf knew that Ancalagon lacked the necessary power. – Ian Thompson Aug 06 '17 at 23:31
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    @JohnMeacham As Ian points out nobody tried to destroy the Ring. Tolkien notes in the Letters that Frodo actually failed the quest: he didn't fail morally because he spent all his effort and will to get to the Cracks of Doom; but after the years of having it and after the struggle to get to Sammath Naur and that being its most powerful place he could not do it. If Gandalf hadn't counselled (and Frodo hadn't pitied Gollum) Frodo on 'Pity' then the quest would have failed; the Nazgûl would have come and ... – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:32
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    @JohnMeacham .. and while they wouldn't hurt him or assault him right there they would try to manipulate him to come see his new kingdom. In either case Sauron would have come and Frodo would be utterly destroyed. So not only did Isildur fail to destroy the Ring, Gollum never intended to and while Frodo set out to he never was able to get himself to do so. In other words nobody ever tried those things. – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:34
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It was an intelligent guess, presumably made by Elrond during the Second Age

Since it was forged by Sauron in Orodruin itself, it was generally assumed that the One Ring could only be destroyed in the same fire that "created" it. Forging in a real world context literally involves the material to be melted (slightly) first, and then shaped into an object, which is in this case, a Ring. If the fires were hot enough to melt it the first time, it would definitely be hot enough to melt it again.

INTO THE FIRE

What did the Elves know about the Ring?:

  • The Elves knew that an all-powerful and all-dominant Ring was forged by Sauron in Mount Doom, thanks to Celebrimbor, who perceived Sauron when he first put on the Ring.

    But the Elves were not so lightly to be caught. As soon as Sauron set the One Ring upon his finger they were aware of him; and they knew him, and perceived that he would be master of them, and of an that they wrought. Then in anger and fear they took off their rings.

    The Silmarillion, Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age

  • This information was very likely to have been relayed down to Galadriel and Gil-galad when Celebrimbor gave them the Elven Rings, and to Elrond and Cirdan when Gil-galad passed them his Rings.

What didn't the Elves know about the Ring?:

How, exactly, to destroy it. Putting two-and-two together, they reckoned that the Ring could only be destroyed in the place it was made in.

  • 'Alas! yes,' said Elrond. 'Isildur took it, as should not have been. It should have been cast then into Orodruin's fire nigh at hand where it was made. But few marked what Isildur did. He alone stood by his father in that last mortal contest; and by Gil-galad only Cirdan stood, and I. But Isildur would not listen to our counsel.

    The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring, Book II, Chapter II, The Council of Elrond

    The Ruling Ring passed out of the knowledge even of the Wise in that age; yet it was not unmade. For Isildur would not surrender it to Elrond and Círdan who stood by. They counselled him to cast it into the fire of Orodruin nigh at hand, in which it had been forged, so that it should perish, and the power of Sauron be for ever diminished, and he should remain only as a shadow of malice in the wilderness.

    The Silmarillion, Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age

  • Second Age: So when the time came to destroy the Ring, Elrond and Cirdan counselled Isildur to destroy it in the fires where it was forged.

  • Third Age: Fast forward, Elrond merely repeats this information at the Council of Elrond.

  • Third Age onwards: Thereafter this so-called "information on how to destroy the Ring" was taken up by the Istari, who came only at around Third Age Year 1000-ish. Saruman, being a Maia of Aule himself, might have given his two-cents on how the Ring could be destroyed (when he was still "good"), but this cannot be confirmed.

As far as we know, as this is never discussed explicitly, it can be assumed as an intelligent guess.

Voronwé
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    You'd think, knowing all of this, that Elrond would have searched the river after Isildur died... Imagine how easy it would have been to toss it in Mt. Doom when Sauron wasn't around. – reirab Aug 07 '17 at 07:24
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    @reirab People in the real world already have difficulty finding human corpses in a river, and that's with technological help like diving suits and ultrasound imaging available. A ring is much smaller than a corpse and also doesn't want to be found. There's no way he'd have found the ring. – b_jonas Aug 07 '17 at 15:40
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    @b_jonas Part of the problem there, though, is that corpses can float downriver and the searches rarely last more than a few days. A ring will mostly just sink and stay put. And he had, what, 3,000 years to dredge the river and with a whole army to do it? – reirab Aug 07 '17 at 16:28
  • @reirab Well, Redcloak orders his hobgoblin minions to search for Xykon's phylactery http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0662.html , and they manage to find it http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0823.html , but I still think finding the ring would be impossible. – b_jonas Aug 07 '17 at 16:33
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    @reirab confusing the right elf at just the right time is all that is needed for the ring to stay unnoticed. Or, for that matter, manipulating a fish or a crab to swallow it and hitch a ride. – MauganRa Aug 08 '17 at 11:39
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    Anyway, if someone DID manage to find the Ring they would have decided to keep it, rather than destroy it. Likely even Elrond wouldn't have had the willpower to throw it into the fire. Gandalf managed to do it only because he knew the Ring wouldn't be damaged. – Michael Foster Jul 12 '23 at 12:51
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This is only a theory. There doesn't seem to be a definitive answer.

The Council of Elrond didn't know how to destroy the ring, not with certainty. They gathered the best experts available to discuss the possibility. Throwing it into Orodruin was their best guess, not their definitive solution.

From a narrative standpoint, this makes Frodo's errand even more desperate. If they'd guessed wrong, Sauron would have the ring back, and he would rule Middle-earth.

Voronwé
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Ralph Crown
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The Ainur may be childlike, but they aren't stupid.

Sauron forged the One Ring in Orodruin. This requires it to be hot enough to melt. We know that it was at one point melted, because Sauron emblazoned it with a little poetry written in his pet conlang.

He also funneled a large slice of his fëa (read: SOUL) into it. Saruman and Gandalf would know this - Saruman being an engineer, and Gandalf being the bearer of one of the Three Rings (and therefore having a connection to the One). This is why it corrupts its non-hobbit bearers: Sauron literally has a telepathic connection to the present ringbearer. (Hobbits are less affected because they are naturally resistant to telepathy.)

Therefore, throwing the One into Orodruin would melt the Ring, and destroy the energy pattern locked inside it, thereby killing Sauron.

(Of course, Saruman had planned to extract Sauron's fëa from the Ring so it could be safely used by anyone, but that didn't go through.)

Seska1729
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    Can you back this up with quotes from the books? – Ian Thompson Aug 06 '17 at 22:40
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    It absolutely did corrupt the hobbits; it's just they were more resilient to some of the corruption i.e. took longer. And look at Gollum: a distant Stoor if not a Stoor outright. And furthermore, it did NOT kill Sauron; he was diminished to a shadow that could never threaten Middle-earth again but he did not die. He lingered on as a shadow. – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:39
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    I should also say that if the hobbits had taken the Ring by force like poor Sméagol did it would have taken them much quicker. That's part of the Ring's nature. – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:39
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    Forging does not require the metal to be hot enough to melt. In fact, that would make it impossible to forge. A forge makes it soft enough to hammer. Casting requires the metal be heated until it melts. – RichS Aug 08 '17 at 00:46
  • @Pryftan as was expected, as the ring "only" contained like 99% of his fëa. – MauganRa Aug 08 '17 at 11:42
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    @MauganRa Indeed. But some people suggest it did kill him. For example the actual answer I was responding to. But perhaps I take it too literally and in any event it's all things considered the same result: no longer a threat. – Pryftan Aug 09 '17 at 22:33
  • @RichS, you are doubtless correct, but the rules are different with magic. Something Sauron did in the forging of the Ring made it more like super-gold. After all, a little fire doesn't even heat the Ring, let alone melt it. The Ring was probably forged in temperatures easily hot enough to melt normal gold. Maybe he used knowledge from Aulë to polarize the gold, surround it with magnets... – Michael Foster Jul 12 '23 at 12:59
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Gandalf is one of the lesser gods of creation, the Maiar, what he does and doesn't know is never made clear but as a servant of Eru Ilúvatar his power in Arda is almost limitless, although the restraints placed on it's use are almost total, but his knowledge base is unavoidably huge. He arrives in Middle-Earth after the fall of Númenor and Eregion to Sauron's machinations and the sealing off of the utmost west, therefore he knows the history of the One Ring (I seem to recall that he's one of the Maiar who is actually there when Númenor and Eregion go down in ruin, or just before, but I could be wrong). He actually knows more about the Ring than he does about Middle-Earth, he's not native to the world we see him in when we read The Lord of the Rings. There's a lot about this in the appendices at the end of The Lord of the Rings, more of it, in particular the origins of the Wizards, is in The Book of Lost Tales under Istari but most of it is in The Silmarillion, particularly the fall of Númenor and Eregionand the end of the second age, which is a heavy read to say the least but worthwhile if you actually want to understand the world of Tolkien.

Edit: Apparently I'm wrong and Gandalf doesn't know what's going on, Celebrimbor doesn't make it out of Eregion but Elrond does, he may or may not know what's going on, Celebrimbor is a ring-smith in his own right it would make sense for him to know but he's dead.

Ash
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    Gandalf states that he's forgotten the things he knew before and the life he had before. That means regardless of the supposed knowledge he had of the rings, he's forgotten it. – Edlothiad Aug 07 '17 at 12:38
  • @Edlothiad That's when he becomes Gandalf the White though isn't it? Therefore after the Council of Elrond where he imparts the necessary information to the quest. – Ash Aug 07 '17 at 12:50
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    No it's when he's first sent to Middle-earth. When he become Gandalf the White he forgets everything he's done up to that point, people speculate this is because he's been given back his memories of Aman which led to him becoming confused. The Istari were given a brain wipe and made to forget most of their past lives. This would aid them in not taking forms of power and/or majesty – Edlothiad Aug 07 '17 at 12:51
  • @Edlothiad Oh okay clearly I missed that bit I'll have to (shudder, shudder) reread The Silmarillion and check which elves made it out of Númenor and the West before the fall then because that's the only other source I can think of. – Ash Aug 07 '17 at 12:56
  • Oh don't worry about rereading The Silmarillion, (**shudder** indeed), it's in LotR IIRC – Edlothiad Aug 07 '17 at 12:57
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    Here you go. For it is said indeed that being embodied the Istari had need to learn much anew by slow experience, and though they knew whence they came the memory of the Blessed Realm was to them a vision from afar off, for which (so long as they remained true to their mission) they yearned exceedingly. From the UT – Edlothiad Aug 07 '17 at 12:59
  • @Edlothiad I wonder then if knowing how to destroy the Ring comes from the knowledge of ring wearers that Lady Galadriel talks about, Sauron forged it, he knew it's weaknesses, he wore it for a long time, did the wearers of the Three learn some of his secrets I wonder. – Ash Aug 07 '17 at 13:17
  • I don't think Gandalf (or more precisely Olorin) was present at the downfall of Numenor, or the fall of Eregion. Also, I don't think any elves escaped the downfall of Numenor, because none were there. – Ian Thompson Aug 07 '17 at 13:59
  • @IanThompson More precisely Olórin, you mean. – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:42
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    And what's wrong with The Silmarillion ? I do have a theory but maybe I'm wrong. I'm curious if it really is this: is the problem all the names and locations it's hard to keep track of ? And maybe something to do with the different stories all in one (even though they tie together) ? I quite like TS though I don't read it as often as the others. Not saying you need to read it though although certainly Tolkien at least at some point thought it'd be easier (I think the opposite for most people but some actually did send him letters asking him about more history). – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 17:44
  • @Pryftan No it's the same thing that's wrong with Tolkien generally, and with Lovecraft and Herbert's early work, the style is more academic than literary, that makes for heavy going when the subject is fictional because the style interferes with rather than supporting the narrative. – Ash Aug 07 '17 at 17:52
  • @Ash I guess that comes with the fact it's meant to be mythology + history. As he describes it's imagined history in our world (as Middle-earth is our world or part of it anyway). Is that what you mean ? That it's fiction but meant to be non-fiction which makes it hard to read for (my understanding is 'most') people ? – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 18:06
  • @Pryftan Yeah kind of, this is hard, to start with it's written like a treatise or an essay instead of a piece of fiction. It's also inconcisely written and not the way Zelazny is where he can take two pages to describe a scene that other writers would take ten words for but the pages still fly by it still feels rich and engaging. The overall style of Dune and The Lord of The Rings is very long winded while telling you nothing much and The Silmarillion is Tolkien in maximum lecture/minimum storyteller mode. – Ash Aug 07 '17 at 18:24
  • @Ash I see. Thanks for the feedback :) I appreciate it a lot! Of course it was his first work and his last work and he spent a lot of time and effort trying to work it out. I must admit I found the Music of the Ainur (might not be the exact title; don't have any of my copies handy) a bit difficult but that's because it has the religious type of .. I don't even know how to word it other than it wasn't the easiest. Still, I got beyond that as I really wanted to know more. I'm glad I did because the Silmarillion proper is in my eyes a beautiful story - and what follows is great too. – Pryftan Aug 07 '17 at 23:55
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    @Pryftan It is a good story so is Dune that doesn't make them less awkward to read just more rewarding in the end. – Ash Aug 08 '17 at 11:13
  • Well I agree with that, if I interpret your meaning right: but personally I don't cringe at the thought of TS because I quite enjoy it. But there certainly are works I would cringe over but whether I would have the strength then to actually read it I don't know. Strength? I think more like motivation and patience. But all the more power to those who can/do have the motivation/patience for works that tire them. – Pryftan Aug 09 '17 at 22:36
  • @Pryftan Ever read Polaris? – Ash Aug 13 '17 at 07:06
  • @Ash No, I've not. Why ? What is the genre and who is the author etc. ? – Pryftan Aug 14 '17 at 17:39
  • @Pryftan It's a sci-fi novel, they made a terrible George Clooney movie from it. It's by a polish author by the name of Stanislaw Lem, it's an really interesting story of an encounter between humanity and something really truly alien but in English it's also a translation or transliteration so very hard to get to grips with. The reason i mention it is I've read it about five or six times and every time I wondered why I'd done it to myself. – Ash Aug 14 '17 at 17:45
  • @Pryftan Oops I must have been half asleep the story is Solaris not Polaris. – Ash Aug 16 '17 at 11:18
  • @Ash Ah, much like many people feel, I presume, with The Silmarillion. Is that what you mean ? – Pryftan Aug 16 '17 at 19:05
  • ...though I guess this isn't really meant to be here in comments. So can disregard that question. Pretty sure that's what you meant anyway. – Pryftan Aug 16 '17 at 19:05
  • @Pryftan It's certainly how I feel about The Simarillion. – Ash Aug 16 '17 at 19:10