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Many Federation citizens, particularly those in Starfleet, seem to be openly hostile to the Ferengi and appear to have strong prejudices against them.

For example, when two Ferengi narrowly escape a doomed shuttle, Riker tells Worf to give them quarters "not too close to mine." He hadn't even met them, or spoken to them, but was still keen to keep them away from where he lived.

Others seem to automatically assume Ferengi will be trouble, too. Is this not prejudice in the literal sense? Is it not bias against their entire race?

Ham Sandwich
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    Their entire race if known for wanting money, money, money. WHy wouldn't you be slighlty suspicious? – Mithical Jan 19 '17 at 21:23
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    Is it discrimination if it's justified by experience? – Petersaber Jan 19 '17 at 22:10
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    Yes, @Petersaber. You are still discriminating against somebody based on experiences with other people, and you are prejudging a specific individual against the assumptions and stereotypes of his species and culture. That doesn't mean one has to give them an unlimited replicator account to prove you're not a racist. It just means you have to give them the benefit of the doubt, be cautious, be open to defying stereotype, and not send them to the other side of the ship just because of their species. – Zoey Green Jan 19 '17 at 22:20
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    @ZoeyBoles sorry, I am terrible at English (and overall expressing my thoughts). What makes it worse is that the thing I am trying to ask is only applicable in some fiction, and never in real life. So here goes my second (and last) attempt. Is being wary of X "discrimination" if every time you encounter X it gives you reasons to be wary of it, and strenghtens existing reasons? Like I said, applicable only in fiction, where your character is defined by your species (and exceptions are incredibly rare anomalies, iike Nog) and not non-human you. Note that I am not disputing it, just asking. – Petersaber Jan 19 '17 at 22:32
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    @Petersaber: your English is better than mine, and I grew up here. And it doesn't help that this is a hard topic. "Prejudice" specifically means "judging somebody before you know them," so TECHNICALLY, even if every Ferengi you met stole your wallet, assuming that the next one will is, indeed, prejudice. Moving a Ferengi to another deck just to be "far away from them" is discrimination. In a science-fictional world full of planets of hats, it's probably justifiable to be prejudiced, but it doesn't change the reality of prejudice. It's silly complex. – Zoey Green Jan 19 '17 at 22:47
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    @Petersaber, I want to be clear that I'm not attacking your question, it's just very complex and hard to word correctly. What I'm trying to say is that you are justified in changing your behavior around Ferengi based on experience, but you shouldn't be cruel, mean, or obvious about it. Don't leave your wallet on the table unless that Ferengi has earned your trust; but don't make a loud point about how nobody should leave wallets on tables around people like hiiiiiiim, if that makes a bit more sense. – Zoey Green Jan 19 '17 at 22:53
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    #NotAllFerengi? – Robotnik Jan 20 '17 at 03:30
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    @ZoeyBoles That's correct. Even though it would be efficient and convenient for you to change your behavior around Ferengi (in ways that harm those Ferengi) based on experience, you still shouldn't do it because honest Ferengi have a moral right to equal treatment as honest humans and one cannot justly punish them for the behavior of other Ferengi. So, for example, if you are slower to trust a Ferengi crewman over a human based on your experience with other Ferengi, that is immoral. Sentients deserve to be evaluated on their own merits, even where that is harder for you to do. #NotAllFerengi – David Schwartz Jan 20 '17 at 04:32
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    @ZoeyBoles, that's actually textbook racism. Treating people based on your experiences and perception of their race, albeit quietly and discreetly, and then expecting them to redeem themselves for the sins you attributed to them. – user Jan 20 '17 at 08:59
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    @ZoeyBoles so are you stating that e.g. women clutching their handbags more tightly when they near a black man is justified? – errantlinguist Jan 20 '17 at 11:27
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    I think there should be an important distinction between members of a culture and members of a race. If you know someone follows Ferengi culture, you can make assumptions about them. Otherwise, assuming they're part of that culture just by the shape of their ears, that's where it gets problematic. – DaaaahWhoosh Jan 20 '17 at 16:18
  • @ZoeyBoles So swimmers shouldn't freak out when they see a shark in the water because that would be discrimination against sharks? Gotcha. :) – Deepak Jan 23 '17 at 02:35
  • racially discriminated or culturally discriminated? wow, what an interesting conversation to arise out of a fictional situation. I totally see the error in faulting a man (using the word in the sense of 'mankind') solely because of his ethnic genetics, but is it wrong to discriminate against a person because of their culture? – Chris Hayes Jan 23 '17 at 05:56
  • @Deepak No, I mean, sure. The type of people who are Super PC Trolls should totally stay in the water with sharks. Discrimination and racism only matter because the target of the discrimination is sentient with feelings to be hurt. I totally discriminate against big hairy spiders; they're the only creature I exterminate on sight. But it's not "discrimination" to avoid a black widow spider because you can't reason with it, and being non-sentient, it's unlikely you can negotiate with it. – Zoey Green Jan 23 '17 at 06:00
  • @Deepak The conversation gets more interesting because what we call "sentience" seems to have a scale. I wouldn't say an ant is "sentient," but my cats and my sister's dogs, while not being self aware or literate, seem to be more sentient. Being domesticated, a well trained pit bull can be an extremely loving pet. Discrimination against pit bulls is well known due to the bad rap the breed gets from horrible pet owners. A discussion can be made on if this discrimination is actually "discrimination" against a person or not, depending on how much credit you give to animals. – Zoey Green Jan 23 '17 at 06:02

7 Answers7

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Yes, it is, and it's a bit more proof that the Federation can be hypocritical.

The Federation claims to be open, free, and all accepting, and as proof they do seem to be all these things. But some times, some people can be outright hostile, bigoted, and prejudiced.

The example you provide is, like you said, THE definition of prejudice; "An adverse judgment or opinion formed beforehand or without knowledge or examination of the facts." Two Ferengi appear, and Riker wants them "not too close." Not because they are at war with the Ferengi, they are not. Not because they have a Cold-War type relationship, because they don't. Not because Riker considers them a security threat, because at that time they are not.

He wants them far away because they are Ferengi and they like money. Trying to "justify" this as "OK" because "All Ferengi are Greedy" or "They love money" is pretty disgusting; not every Ferengi is greedy (some are positively philantropic, at least measured against other ferengi). We learn in DS9 that much of what Ferengis believe are due to their cultural upbringing; they are doing right by their own book. If they are not actively harming you and being greedy... is that actually a basis to want them "far away?" I would state: no. It's prejudice.

Riker talks about the Ferengi as if they were "children" in their first encounter in Season One's The Last Outpost. Riker's low opinion of Ferengi fairly reeks of prejudice. So, yes, he's being prejudiced and probably technically racist ("You're bad because you're Ferengi.")

Part of the problem here is that Star Trek was a "Planet of Hats" show until DS9. In TNG and TOS, Romulans were Sneaky, Klingons were Angry, and Ferengi were Greedy. Each species was defined as a narrow caricature and always used as such. In a real universe of "Planets of Hats," it's believable that you COULD pre-judge somebody based on their species. But Star Trek VI, DS9, and Voyager opened up a much more diverse universe. Klingons could be diplomats. Ferengi could be magnanimous. Humans could be rebels fighting against the "Free Federation." Considering that Star Trek VI takes place before TNG in the timeline, I would classify Riker as racist.

Is prejudice bad? Ahh, now that's a different question, and one I'm not qualified to talk about. Human brains are wet meat filters of data, and we do a bad job at it (just barely good enough to stay alive). I'd submit that you shouldn't leave your wallet on the table next to a Ferengi you've never met. But not because he's a Ferengi... because your experience with their culture lets you know that they'll take your wallet and feel good about it. You might even make the case that making a show of hiding your wallet is RESPECT for Ferengi culture, showing that you are not naive and you recognize the value his society has in money... but that's a tarpit I'm not going to walk into on the Internet.

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    Ferengi were also rumored to eat people early in TNG. – Xantec Jan 20 '17 at 01:58
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    Has Riker had a positive interaction with the Ferengi by that point or only negative ones? If he's only had negative interactions it's not prejudice, he's judging by experience. – Separatrix Jan 20 '17 at 08:07
  • Thanks Zoey, I agree with most of what you wrote. I'd point out though that we don't have any evidence that the Ferengi are thieves though, at least not any more than some porportion of any race are criminals. It seems like their Rules of Acquisition would compel them to cheat you out of the contents of your wallet, rather than just stealing it outright. – user Jan 20 '17 at 09:06
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    @Separatrix if you are robbed by a black man it is not OK to treat all black men as thieves. Experience does not cancel out prejudice. – OrangeDog Jan 20 '17 at 09:34
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    @OrangeDog, It's not about being robbed by one black man, it's about being robbed by every Ferengi. There were later positive interactions, but had they had one by that point. – Separatrix Jan 20 '17 at 09:37
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    @Separatrix I'm afraid even if every one you ever meet robs you, it's still prejudice (pre-judging) to assume that the next one will. – OrangeDog Jan 20 '17 at 09:53
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    @OrangeDog: I’d say, there is a significant difference between coincidental similarities (when being robbed by black man several times) and systematic ones (when being robbed by people coming from a culture that embraces greed). Of course, this depends on your knowledge about the background. The sole experience of being robbed several times is not enough to judge. You need even more background information to decide whether each member of the Ferengi race is also undoubtedly having said Ferengi culture background. – Holger Jan 20 '17 at 10:09
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    "You might even make the case that making a show of hiding your wallet is RESPECT for Ferengi culture, showing that you are not naive and you recognize the value his society has in money"

    This is great.

     – deworde Jan 20 '17 at 10:40
  • It sounds like a lot of people bought into the racial stereotype of Ferengi being thieves, is based on the Federation's early encounters with them. – user Jan 20 '17 at 11:46
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    It seems people are trying to argue "Is prejudice bad?" rather than "what is prejudice". – OrangeDog Jan 20 '17 at 11:50
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    @OrangeDog: "if you are robbed by a black man it is not OK to treat all black men as thieves. Experience does not cancel out prejudice" That is absolutely right. However, you are also correct in that the bigger question is "is prejudice bad?" If you went to a country that literally went out of its way to openly declare that their culture was all about robbing people, would you be prejudiced to assume that one of their citizens wanted to rob you? Yes. Would that be a justified statistical inference? Also yes! Would you be justified in paying closer attention to your wallet? Absolutely. – Lightness Races in Orbit Jan 20 '17 at 12:56
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    Since the Ferengi culture has actually codified greed in to their laws, I would argue that assuming a Ferengi is greedy isn't really prejudice. But they are certainly discriminated against for that, and other reasons. – Bradley Uffner Jan 20 '17 at 15:21
  • Keep in mind that Riker had previously had several bad experiences with The Ferengi prior to the episode. – Omegacron Jan 20 '17 at 16:31
  • @deworde I agree. Although this begs the question of how do you make a show out of hiding your wallet... ;) – Erik Jan 20 '17 at 18:25
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    @deworde DS9 has a couple examples with Quark, which is where I got the idea. Usually it boils down to a Starfleeter standing up, then going "OH!", looking Quark square in the eyes, and picking up their bars of latinum. Or even saying out loud that they are taking their money and going. Dax was the best at "respecting Ferengi culture." Even being a female, and all the Ferengi's prejudices (!!) about that, she was able to earn the respect of the Ferengi on the station by playing by their rules around them. – Zoey Green Jan 20 '17 at 18:58
  • @ゼーロ: "I'd point out though that we don't have any evidence that the Ferengi are thieves though, at least not any more than some porportion of any race are criminals" - actually, Enterprise follows the Ferengi vessel in The Last Outpost in the first place because of "a T9 energy converter which the Ferengi stole from an unmanned monitor post (...) A theft which automatic scanners recorded". And those Ferengi were not some "random criminals", but apparently members of the Ferengi military, implying that their behaviour may be officially accepted. – O. R. Mapper Jan 21 '17 at 00:04
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    "Riker talks about the Ferengi as if they were "children" in their first encounter in Season One's The Last Outpost." - for what it's worth, he was primarily referring to the particular ship and its crew rather than all Ferengi. The particular crew whose members first stole some equipment (which is why Enterprise had followed them), then behaved quite aggressively to the Enterprise crew during the first conversations, then physically attacked and disabled the Starfleet away team, and then tried to get the Portal's attention in an admittedly silly way ("We knew the same answer.") – O. R. Mapper Jan 21 '17 at 00:16
  • This post is begging for a TVTropes link: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/PlanetOfHats. (Standard warning applies.) – jpmc26 Jan 21 '17 at 17:14
  • Also in Rikers defense the 2 Ferengi that boarded the Enterprise were harassing him non stop.They annoyed him personally on that occasion too, so its not unreasonable for him to want them kept away from him - they showed the same behavior as the ones he met previously, wanting to get away from someone that's annoying you isn't prejudice as its judging the individual based on their current behavior – Matt Dec 13 '19 at 17:10
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Yes. The Ferengi are frequently discriminated against.

Example

Dr. Reyga was a young Ferengi Scientist. A fair bit of the plot of the TNG Episode "Suspicions" deals with the trouble he's had being taken seriously. He refers to the scientific community beyond just the Federation. The delegation brought to see his discovery include a Klingon, and a Takaran (not likely a Federation member). None of which view him with an open mind. Reyga himself mentions his people's reputation. It's not his age, but specifically his species.

"This is an opportunity I would never have had without you, and I promise you, I'll never forget it." "Some of the scientists still seem a little doubtful, but after the demonstration I'm sure they'll come around." "Well, if there's anything I'm used to, it's skepticism. After all, a Ferengi scientist is almost a contradiction in terms. No, don't deny it. I know how the Ferengi are regarded." -- Reyga and Beverly Crusher

This reputation isn't just confined to the Federation. Here's an exchange between Kira (Bajoran) and Jadzia (Federation-Trill). Note that Jadzia, even as a Federation Scientist, doesn't argue with Kira's negative beliefs, just says they can still be fun.

"They're greedy, misogynistic, untrustworthy little trolls, and I wouldn't turn my back on one of them for a second." "Neither would I. But once you accept that, you'll find they can be a lot of fun." – Kira Nerys and Jadzia Dax, 2370 ("Rules of Acquisition")

Analysis

The Ferengi have an ideology diametrically opposed to the Federation, and Humanity in particular,

The Federation has abolished currency and want. The Ferengi have built their entire culture around money and profit.

Greed is eternal. -- Rule of Aquisition #10

The Ferengi also consider women to effectively be property. Marriage is a temporary contract between the Husband and the woman's Father. This is very much opposed to the Federations declared abhorrence of slavery or inequality.

Finally, the Ferengi and Federation have experienced open conflict for a fair period of their relationship. TNG shows the first recorded visual contact with Ferengi by the federation which, although it ended peaceably, included ship-combat. By the end of DS9 they have only been known for 12 years (first visual contact 2364, end of DS9 2376). Picard destroyed a Ferengi vessel while captain of the Stargazer, and several times throughout the series is attacked by Ferengi.

Riker has fair reason to distrust the Ferengi, as all of his experience has been negative up until the point of your example in the 5th season. Their initial meeting is combative, after the Ferengi stole Federation property. Daimon Bok is an antagonist in a first season episode, and again in the 7th. Picard is taken prisoner by another Ferengi in season 3 while on vacation. Even after your example, his suspicions are proven correct when the Ferengi attempt to buy a woman on the ship, and end up injuring an Ambassador.

This is clearly prejudiced on Riker's park. Even if his experience is entirely negative, he is judging these Ferengi on their race alone. Other characters present similar distaste of the Ferengi.

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ench
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    I would also point out that poor Dr. Reyga was murdered for his tech, which actually DID work, and the whole plan was based on the assumption that the murderer, , could spruce up the plans a bit, wait a while, and then come out with his brilliant invention, and everyone would just accept that he was just inspired* by Reyga because Reyga was only a silly Ferengi,* not that the functioning tech was stolen, even though that would be easily proved by anyone checking the replicator records for the original device. – Zoey Green Jan 19 '17 at 23:00
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    The Tellarites also had a very poor attitude towards women, but it didn't seem to result in the same kind of prejudice. Okay, different times, but you would think that Federation citizens would see that changing attitudes like that was best done through friendship and cooperation rather than hostility and racism. – user Jan 20 '17 at 09:16
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    Hmm, hadn't considered the Tellarites, never watched much ENT. It's understandable during the founding of the Federation though, enforcing ones ideals on ally's would be different, and they desperately needed allies at the time right? It seems that during the later era (TNG) either humans have dominated the Federation, or their ideals have become dominant in the Federation culture. – ench Jan 20 '17 at 16:43
  • This is a great answer, except for "women" part. That assumption is 100% wholly contradicted by the fact that Federation is absolutely peachy-fine with sexism, exemplified by treatment of men as close to property and slaves (and most certainly discriminated against) by Betazoid culture. – DVK-on-Ahch-To Jan 21 '17 at 00:36
  • That's why I included the "declared" part. The shows are generally very pro-equality, but there are still plenty of problems when you look. – ench Jan 21 '17 at 00:38
  • in DS9, Nog also faced resistance when wanting to join Starfleet. Most Starfleet personnel didn't take him seriously, and even though this was more because of his reputation as a mischief due to his behavior on the station, if I recall there was also a stern conversation with Sisko regarding Ferengi motives for profit and the like. – Robotnik Mar 22 '17 at 03:39
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That particular episode in TNG, I think it was more of the writers for that episode trying to impose some sense of distrust, considering that the Ferengi as a whole were more of a rogue civilization. I remember a documentary saying that TNG writers were trying to have the Ferengi replace the Klingons. But later in TNG, and once DS9 came around, they create a new perspective. There's even a TNG episode where Riker makes a call to Deep Space 9 to turn in an IOU on gambling winnings for a favor.

I think DS9 did a better representing the Ferengi. Here they are cunning traders. They're even called upon to do some trade negotiations. There was an episode on DS9 where Quark discovered treachery in the Klingon Empire and the Chancelor accused a Klingon of using "Money to bring down a great house". Another episode Quark was stuck with a gamma quadrant ambassador/weapons dealer in the Defiant mess hall due to a dominion attack, dismantling a dud warhead that pierced the bulkhead.

Sure, other species are wary, because their own laws dictate that greed is good. But otherwise, they're considered to be another, yet quirky member of the Alpha/Beta Quadrants, and even useful allies.

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  • What episode did Riker contact DS9 for that? I'd like to see that. :-) – corsiKa Jan 20 '17 at 03:51
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    @corsiKa: http://memory-alpha.wikia.com/wiki/Firstborn_(episode) – Ellesedil Jan 20 '17 at 05:23
  • http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0708716/ – as.beaulieu Jan 20 '17 at 05:32
  • Season 7, Episode 21 "Firstborn" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VDLq51joXPw – as.beaulieu Jan 20 '17 at 05:32
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    "the Ferengi as a whole were more of a rogue civilization" Well that's pretty offensive. Rogue civilisation? Just because they're culturally different from your own? What have they gone rogue from? Federation ideals to which they never subscribed in the first place? – Lightness Races in Orbit Jan 20 '17 at 12:59
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    It wasn't meant to offend, it was more to be according to the definition of a rogue nation or rogue state, "One that does not respect other states in its international actions." That is what they did. They traded with anyone, even when it was in someone else's territory, and they didn't like it. But that was their core values and belief. Free market is religion to the Ferengi. It wasn't just the Federation as well. Klingon Empire, Romulan Empire, the Ferengi didn't care. – as.beaulieu Jan 20 '17 at 16:13
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    @LightnessRacesinOrbit - I'm offended that you're offended. – Omegacron Jan 20 '17 at 16:33
  • @as.beaulieu: You're describing the Orion Syndicate; I don't think the Ferengi were ever quite that bad – Lightness Races in Orbit Jan 20 '17 at 17:32
  • @Omegacron: I'm not! Now what? – Lightness Races in Orbit Jan 20 '17 at 17:32
  • @LightnessRacesinOrbit, I agree, the Ferengi Alliance is not as bad as the Orion Syndicate, which even in the TNG/DS9 era is a full criminal organization. But you have individual or groups of ferengi that would try questionable enterprises that made others wary of them. One Ferengi captain even salvaged the Stargazer to get revenge on Captain Picard. – as.beaulieu Jan 20 '17 at 17:42
  • @as.beaulieu: And multiple star systems of Federation citizens took up arms against not only a Federation ally (the Cardassians) but fired upon Starfleet vessels! Or how about Section 31, going around assassinating foreign diplomats, and orchestrating political coups? Sooo does this make the Federation a rogue civilization? – Lightness Races in Orbit Jan 20 '17 at 18:05
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    @LightnessRacesinOrbit - well, shucks. Now I'm offended that you're not offended at my offense. – Omegacron Jan 20 '17 at 19:56
  • @LightnessRaces I don't think so. The Marquis is an internal dispute, and Section 31 could be an extremist faction that doesn't represent the whole of the Federation. But how about you put that question up on Slack for everyone to answer instead of posting it in a comment? Or maybe find another forum, because you know you're trying to argue and attack about a fictional story and characters, right? – as.beaulieu Jan 20 '17 at 21:33
  • @Omegacron: I'm afraid we're at a classic impasse, Mr President – Lightness Races in Orbit Jan 21 '17 at 00:19
  • @as.beaulieu: It's "Maquis", and yes that's the point. Those Ferengi weren't the entire state -- they were one group of Ferengi. As for the rest of your comment I will ignore it because it was non-constructive and rude. – Lightness Races in Orbit Jan 21 '17 at 00:27
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Yes and no.

The Federation's culture and values are diametrically opposed to those of the Ferengi culture. The Federation has made an effort to abolish need and want, and reject profit as a value, and they've actually been largely successful. The Ferengi culture regards greed and profit as the highest virtues.

Given that Ferengi culture appears to be monolithic, Federation members make a reasonable assumption that any Ferengi they encounter subscribes to this culture, and treat them accordingly.

On the rare occasion that a Ferengi disavows this culture, such as Nog, they are treated just like any member of the Federation. Their race is a non-issue.

As more such Ferengi are encountered, the way in which Ferengi are treated when initially encountered will surely change to recognize this.

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    It is somewhat noteworthy how Klingons are not shown to be treated like that (instead, it seemed to be somewhat "hip" to know about Klingon culture on some occasions during the 24th century), implying that "greed and profit" are a lot worse than willingness to exert physical violence towards other people. – O. R. Mapper Jan 20 '17 at 23:57
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    @O.R.Mapper The federation has been at peace with the Klingons for decades. Previously, in TOS, Klingons were not characterized so positively. Ferengi are new. Additionally, Klingon culture is about "honor", not violence. The Federation can understand honor. – DCShannon Jan 21 '17 at 00:13
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    Also note that the Federation don't treat native Klingons like the average Federation member. Riker is a lot more aggressive towards Klingons because he's embracing and tolerating their culture, rather than pretending it's the same.

    The issue with the Ferengi culture is that it appears so diametrically opposed to Federation values that Riker simply can't interact with it. This may be different for other Starfleet officers (e.g. Jadzia)

     – deworde Jan 27 '17 at 10:52
  • @deworde I agree completely with all those statements. If a Ferengi states that his highest virtue is greed, then it's not discriminatory to treat him like he's greedy. – DCShannon Jan 30 '17 at 23:41
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On one occasion, Rom is told by O'Brien and Jadzia that not being as much of a Ferengi is a good thing. Racist condescension.

Carlton
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  • Hi, welcome to SF&F. This would be a stronger answer if you could cite when this happens, and perhaps provide an exact quote. It would also help if you could show more examples, so it's clear that it's not just Jadzia/Dax and O'Brien who are racist. – DavidW Mar 19 '21 at 18:34
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A better question is it discrimination to act as if someone represents a positive role model in their culture, until you have reason to suspect otherwise?

As others have said, there is a basic cultral conflict between them and the Federation. We haven't seen someone that knows them treating unknown Ferengi, as if they don't follow the RoA.

Of course, the answer is yes, positive discrimination is a thing. And the Ferengi probably encounter plenty of it. They would probably be gratified, if it didn't interfere with making a profit (rule of acquisition 77).

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I think the core premise of your question is flawed.

Is it really "racial discrimination" if you have a good respect of individuals of a species you only know from school?

As you said, Riker never saw them before so he couldn't have built his own perception of them really, except based on what he knows from books/data-terminals. As we all know books written as objective as they can be, they are still subjective since it was the author who decided which are the objective facts and which are not.

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    Yes, it's discrimination if you automatically make negative assumptions about people based on their race, even if those assumptions are based on your personal experience or what you have read/heard about them. – user Jan 20 '17 at 09:59
  • @ゼーロ i say your wrong it's not discrimination- it would be if Riker would have said to not let them on the Ship or to to put him in the Arrest Cell but what Riker said was to put him not to close to him i think he acted extremely intelligent- guess what could happen if you put two People who really don't like each other really close together - they would alway or at least more than the otherway get confronted with each other so the escalation of conflicts is programmed - if you can avoid conflicts its always a good thing to do so – konqui Jan 21 '17 at 16:57
  • that's the standard argument used by those pushing for racial segregation. – user Jan 21 '17 at 21:30