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The prohibition of "PSIKA" forbids paying for a purchase in advance of receiving the item purchased if the seller will not charge the buyer more in the case of a price increase at the time of receipt of the product purchased. The actual pre-payment is forbidden, even if no eventual price increase occurred. Thus, why is it permitted to purchase a lottery or raffle ticket in advance of the drawing time, being that the purchaser receives nothing at the time of purchase? (The ticket itself is not the item purchased, it is rather just a record of his payment to enter the lottery or raffle at the time of the drawing).

mbloch
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RibbisRabbiAndMore
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  • It sounds like you are saying that options (see https://www.investopedia.com/university/options/option.asp) constitute ribbis. Is that correct? – Dov F Apr 24 '18 at 23:16
  • @Dov F Certain options, when purchased from a Jew, may have ribbis issues.. One should consult with a Rabbinical authority who is well versed both in the commodity market and in the laws of ribbis before purchasing options from a Jewish source. – RibbisRabbiAndMore Apr 24 '18 at 23:21
  • I'm unfamiliar with the rule of p'sika, but can we say as follows? Consider someone who lost the lottery. What did he purchase? Obviously only the chance to win. So that's all the winner purchased also (and its delivery is at the time of drawing, before the winner is discovered, and it hasn't risen in value yet). The later delivery of winnings is not of the purchased item but separate from the purchase and thus not subject to p'sika. – msh210 Apr 25 '18 at 00:59
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    This question would be more valuable to more readers if it would cite a source for its first two sentences. By the way, thanks for your recent spate of answers: thank you for bringing your expertise to Mi Yodeya. – msh210 Apr 25 '18 at 01:00
  • @msh210 I was not referring to the fact that the payment for the raffle/lottery is made before the reward is given. What I said was that all that any participant in the drawing purchased was, as you said, " a chance to win during the drawing" and as you also said "its delivery is at the time of drawing", thus the payment at the time of the purchase is considered a PREPAYMENT since until the time of the drawing, when the purchaser gets his chance to win, he receives nothing, rendering the payment a loan in the interim, and therefore the laws of Psika should apply. – RibbisRabbiAndMore Apr 25 '18 at 01:27
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    @RibbisRabbi " since until the time of the drawing, when the purchaser gets his chance to win, he receives nothing, " Why does he only receive his "chance to win" at drawing time? He receives it at purchase. –  Apr 25 '18 at 12:10
  • @ Orangesandlemons Because before the drawing the chance to win does not exist yet. The chance only exists at the time of the drawing. – RibbisRabbiAndMore Apr 25 '18 at 17:43
  • @RibbisRabbiAndMore why does it only exist at the time of drawing? The time of winning is at the drawing; the chance to win is having a conceptual entry in the draw. –  Apr 26 '18 at 12:31
  • @Orangesandlemons If we would say that at the time of payment the buyer immediately receives "a conceptual" entry in the drawing, and thus his payment is not considered a "Prepayment", then there would never be any such thing as prepayment, because whatever item the payment was given toward the purchase of, the buyer wou;ld immidiately obtain a "conceptual" right to receive the item. Thus every prepayment would become a payment (cont.) – RibbisRabbiAndMore Apr 26 '18 at 17:53
  • and the whole concept of 'psika' which states that because the (subsequent) purchaser DID NOT RECEIVE anything at the time of payment the money is considered a loan to the seller, and thus subject to the laws of ribbis. – RibbisRabbiAndMore Apr 26 '18 at 17:53
  • @RibbisRabbiAndMore the 'chance to win' is conceptual in itself. Decide what your maaseh kinyan is and why the thing you have purchased is not immediately transferred. ("right to purchase" clearly states an additional transfer of ownership is taking place at an enforced reduced price) –  Apr 27 '18 at 11:59
  • @ Orangesandlemons It seems that we are in agreement with each other that the "item" being purchased is the chance to win. The question that still remains to be clarified is when the buyer receives that chance, whether at the time of payment, even though there is no drawing yet at that time so no such chance exists right now, or at the time of the drawing which is when he actually gets his chance at winning. – RibbisRabbiAndMore Apr 28 '18 at 20:39

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