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I Kings 21 .29 'Seest thou how Ahab humbleth himself before Me? because he humbleth himself before Me, I will not bring the evil in his days; but in his son's days will I bring the evil upon his house.

Would like to understand this verse.

Why upon the house of the son,he has nothing to do with it?(it seems)

Aigle
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  • The meforshim about prophesy and about the tanach seem to imply that the son did not do teshuva and therebye continued to merit the (communal) punishment that was decreed upon the dynasty. Had he completely done teshuvah and healed the split, he might not have had the evil prophesy fulfilled (as with Jonah and Nineveh) – sabbahillel Jan 28 '16 at 16:43
  • related to http://judaism.stackexchange.com/questions/67754/how-and-why-is-sin-passed-on – sabbahillel Jan 28 '16 at 17:01
  • @sabbahillel How should he have done teshuva? – Aigle Jan 28 '16 at 20:39
  • @ Danny Schoemann@ sabbahillel@ Daniel@Gershon Gold@ Isaac Moses I dont get it,what is wrong? – Aigle Jan 28 '16 at 20:51
  • @Eagel As an example, he could have torn down the wall the Yeravam built, gotten rid of the idol worship, etc. Since he did not do this, Yehu killed him and his family. – sabbahillel Jan 28 '16 at 22:00

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It is a tremendous question! I have no idea but the Malbim seems to answer it in the following way:

ולכן ע''י שנכנע מפני לא אביא הרעה בימיו וע''י שלא נכנע מלפני אביא הרעה בימי בנו ולא תבוטל הגזרה בהחלט

He points a difference between two types of submission. I understand this that he received mido keneged mido. His submission was an avoidment. An avoidment do not lead to a solution. But I however am not to have really grasped the bottom of the answer of the Malbim.

kouty
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  • @Eagel How understand you the Malbim? Not a kind of mido keneged mido? – kouty Jan 28 '16 at 20:26
  • I have not read Malbi.But how could Ahab get a solution would be the question?Bring an offer or Help all the people Jezabel treated bad? – Aigle Jan 28 '16 at 20:32
  • @Eagel I'm not sure we came to understand each other But if Ahab acquired Yreass Haromemuth, the punition will be annulled. There is two sort of Yrea. the Malbim adapt this difference הנכנע מלפניו != והנכנע מפניו in the case of Ahab he was hiding and fled because of fear of being punished. I called this to seek to circumvent the problem He don't redesign of its worldview. The idea is true, without doubt. Beauty full? I don't know. – kouty Jan 28 '16 at 21:20
  • I think we might have miss understand each other.But could he not repent on yom kippr and why did not the prophet tell him this,how to make things right,why just tell him,you will die? – Aigle Jan 28 '16 at 21:38
  • @Eagel It is not a question of guideline, as how to make shita מן הצוואר או מן העורף The concept of teshuva is compared in Mesilas Yeshorim following th Sefer Haykarime, to harata of nedarime that make: which uprooted the wish from the outset as if he had never exists. What is erroneous never existed And so there is no more catastrophic consequences – kouty Jan 28 '16 at 21:46
  • Here is the words of the Messilas Yeshorim at the end of the 4st chapter

    ושהתשובה תנתן לחוטאים בחסד גמור, שתחשב עקירת הרצון כעקירת המעשה, דהיינו, שבהיות השב מכיר את חטאו ומודה בו ומתבונן על רעתו ושב ומתחרט עליו חרטה גמורה דמעיקרא כחרטת הנדר ממש שהוא מתנחם לגמרי והיה חפץ ומשתוקק שמעולם לא היה נעשה הדבר ההוא ומצטער בלבו צער חזק על שכבר נעשה הדבר ועוזב אותו להבא ובורח ממנו, הנה עקירת הדבר מרצונו, יחשב לו כעקירת הנדר ומתכפר לו. והוא מה שאמר הכתוב (ישעיה ו, ז) וסר עונך וחטאתך תכפר, שהעון סר ממש מהמציאות ונעקר במה שעכשיו מצטער ומתנחם על מה שהיה למפרע.

     – kouty Jan 28 '16 at 21:52
  • sorry man I cant read Hebrew – Aigle Jan 28 '16 at 21:53
  • That is, when... repenting recognizes ..., and admits it, and reflects upon his evil, and repents, and wishes... never been committed, as...wish that a certain vow had never been made, in which case there is complete regret, and he desires and yearns that the deed had never been done, and suffers great anguish in his heart because of its already having been done, and departs from it for the future, ...e uprooting of the act from his will is accredited to him as the uprooting of a vow, and he gains atonement As Scripture states Isaiah 6:7 Your wrong will depart, and your sin will be forgiven – kouty Jan 28 '16 at 22:03
  • @Eagel May be it would be worth if you formulate a new question about it – kouty Jan 28 '16 at 22:24
  • Like if you live in a country in Africa where the Law says,if you steal wood or something your hand will be cut off,so if you did steal wood and you repent and want to tell them,they would cut off your hand.In my mind that would be crazy,but you still need to do Teshuva. – Aigle Jan 28 '16 at 22:26
  • The idea of Teshuva is in bound to truth and goodness. The approach is length and the intermediary steps are featured by a lack of clarity. But it is not a feature of teshuva, without rational there is no teshuva. – kouty Jan 28 '16 at 22:35