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Can someone please explain to me the distinction between Bnei Noach and goyim especially with regard to their halachic obligations or lack thereof.

Joel K
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user18794
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1 Answers1

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Goyim means non-Jews. The word comes from the Hebrew word for nations and simply describes non-Jews without implying anything positive or negative about their behavior.

All non-Jews are expected halachically to follow the 7 Noahide laws (see Sanhedrin 56a). Those non-Jews who do observe these commandments are called Bnei Noach (see here for further reading).

mbloch
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  • The Rambam in the passage you quote doesn't equate righteous of the nations with sons of Noah. (I actually tentatively think that the Rambam does equate the two terms, and I brought a proof to it here, but I would expect to see this explained in your answer) – b a Mar 02 '19 at 20:27
  • @ba I don't understand your comment. If you equate Bnei Noach with those who observe the "Seven Commandments" then the Rambam reads that Bnei Noach are of the Righteous of the nations and have a portion of the world to come. What am I missing? – mbloch Mar 03 '19 at 04:12
  • Um... Bnei Noach are all non-Jews. Those who keep the Seven Mitzvos are Geirei Toshav. – DonielF Mar 03 '19 at 04:22
  • See Rambam, Hil. Melachim 8:10, which disagrees with both of your assertions, that a Ben Noach is different from a goy and that a Ger Toshav must live in Eretz Yisrael. – DonielF Mar 03 '19 at 04:29
  • @DonielF yes I stand corrected. The Rambam calls it this way because he is permitted to dwell in Israel (Issurei Biah 14:7). Still I don't think people equal goy and ben Noach, bnei Noach are those who observe the 7 mitzvot, at least in today's common discourse – mbloch Mar 03 '19 at 04:35
  • @DonielF I see the problem there, but my assertion (really it was only a proposition) that the Rambam uses "son of Noah" to mean "ger toshav" was based on Melachim 10:3 בן נח שנתגייר ומל וטבל ואחר כך רצה לחזור מאחרי ה' ולהיות גר תושב בלבד כשהיה מקודם (implying a ben noach who became a Jew used to be a ger toshav) and 10:10 בן נח ... הואיל והוא ניזון מישראל ומצוה עליהם להחיותו (implying ben noach means someone whom Jews are obligated to make live). How would you explain that if ben noach means non-Jew? – b a Mar 03 '19 at 09:57
  • @ba 10:3 is a case of a Ben Noach who happened to be a Ger Toshav before he converted. 10:10 the Kesef Mishnah explains as referring to a Ben Noach who gave up idolatry but doesn’t keep the rest of the 7 Mitzvos (a Ger Toshav according to some opinions, but not the one that the Halacha follows). – DonielF Mar 03 '19 at 16:47
  • @DonielF But in 10:10 he refers to this person as בן נח, not גר תושב. If he uses בן נח to mean someone who doesn't worship idols, that would still imply a difference between גוי and גר תושב – b a Mar 03 '19 at 22:43
  • @DonielF you might find this observation from R Gil Student helpful: The Ritva (Makkos 9a) divides the gentile world into three theological categories: 1) Ger Toshav, who formally accepts the seven Noahide commandments before a Jewish court; 2) Noahide, who follows the minimal commandments on his own; 3) sinner, who fails to fulfill those seven commandments..... – mbloch Mar 05 '19 at 04:53
  • @DonielF .... The Talmud (Arakhin 29a) says that we can only accept a Ger Toshav when the jubilee year is observed. Since it is not currently observed, a gentile is unable to become a Ger Toshav due to this technicality. – mbloch Mar 05 '19 at 04:54
  • @ba see the two comments above this one – mbloch Mar 05 '19 at 04:54
  • "Goyim" does not mean all non-Jews. If so, Hilchot Melachim wouldn't make sense, where it says you keep the tzedakah of a Ben Noach but must give away the tzedakah of a goy/akum. The answer, is that in the Torah, "goy" does mean "nation", but over time, the term evolved into meaning a non-Jew who's intentions you assume to be for idolatry, and so one must interact with him a certain way. Hilchot Maachalot on yayin nesach is also a good example that shows the got/akum has a different din than other non-Jews, such as Muslims. – EhevuTov Apr 03 '19 at 13:56