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I have heard/read that in some cases a marriage is forbidden on the basis of mismatching kundalis/gunas.

In some other cases it's forbidden because of caste incompatibility.

Basically my question has three parts:

  • Is there any relationship between the two practices?
  • Are the any Hinduism references that explain how kundalis/gunas work?
    • I just want to know how it works not if it works in real-life.
  • Are the any Hinduism references that explain how the caste system works?
    • According to wikipedia the caste system is in part the result of British Colonialism but my Indian friends tell me that the caste system has been around longer than that but that it's not clear if it's or not part of the doctrine.

If you don't have an answer but can point me to reliable sources I would very much appreciate it.

pgpb.padilla
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  • I think kundali matching is an astrological thing, whereas caste is a cultural thing. The two have become completely mixed so there is no idea which is which nowadays :). IMHO caste in the current scenario is no longer pertinent because Brahmins are only lip-service Brahmins i.e. they don't really know Vedas. Kshatriyas don't really rule or fight the wars anymore and almost everyone travels abroad anyways. Thus the very question of caste is now purely cultural and not at all religious :). Kundali matching is however astrological and quite different thing altogether. – Sai Jan 26 '15 at 04:17
  • So, none of them has anything to do with Hinduism? – pgpb.padilla Jan 26 '15 at 05:59
  • well that depends on how would you define Hinduism? IMHO kundali is astrological. It is like how you consult a doctor before taking a medication, similarly you check with astrology before making a marriage decision. It is like a science. Caste is however more complicated, because originally castes were intended to demarcate labor and quality of work (from birth or otherwise is a different issue). Thus it makes sense that a person in Brahmin caste marries another person in Brahmin caste just as the case now where engineers marry engineers and doctors marry doctors (not always but generally) Sir – Sai Jan 26 '15 at 06:05
  • However as of the current world scenario this is no longer applicable as is obvious. For example, Brahmins are supposed to read and recite Vedas and are not supposed to travel overseas. However it is evident here that they do not really follow any of these. Similarly no other caste really follows the scriptural injunctions of what they supposed to. However they are very quick to cite Hindu scriptures when it comes to inter-caste marriage. So the remnants of caste today are more cultural than religious. They mostly used to justify their own cultural conformity so Sir – Sai Jan 26 '15 at 06:09
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    I dont think this is a duplicate question. This question is seeking to understand the correlation between caste and astrological match in the context of marriage, whereas the other is questioning the validity of astrological matchmaking. –  Jan 30 '15 at 17:59
  • @Mr. Alien I have edited the question so that it's clear that it's not a duplicate of http://hinduism.stackexchange.com/q/3259/2349 please re-open the question or please provide some feedback so I can improve it. – pgpb.padilla Feb 03 '15 at 07:56
  • @pgpb.padilla It would be best to pare down your question to a 1 part question that does not duplicate any other question. – cheenbabes Feb 03 '15 at 16:49
  • 1)The only relation between the two practices is the way the kundali matching is done.For e.g., brahmin kundali matching is more elaborate & requires matching of planetary positions,birthstar,rising sign etc.Non-brahmin kundali matching may stop at guna compatibility.2)You will find many books on "Jyotishya sastra" (Hindu astrology)3)Varna system existed but was not divisive or bitter until the British colonization.People co-existed fairly happily because all varnas(castes) have their own dharma towards society & dharma was held supreme.Depletion of dharma seems fairly rapid since then. –  Feb 08 '15 at 18:11
  • @cheenbabes The first part of the question is: "Is there any relationship between the two practices?", referring to the caste system and kundalis/gunas. How is that a duplicate of "Does marriage really depends on Kundali and Gunas? " – pgpb.padilla Jun 05 '15 at 15:42
  • @Mr. Alien Is there a reason this question has not been re-opened? – pgpb.padilla Jun 05 '15 at 15:43
  • @pgpb.padilla Yes because it's a duplicate – Mr. Alien Jun 05 '15 at 18:08
  • @pgpb.padilla There's multiple issues with your question as currently stated. First of all, you're asking too many questions in the same post. For instance, how the caste system works is a big topic, so it shouldn't be combined with other questions. So you should edit your post to focus on a single question, like how do the kundali restrictions on marriage relate to the Varna (caste) restrictions on marriage? And the stuff about how the kundali restrictions on marriage work are a duplicate of the linked question, so you should take that stuff out. – Keshav Srinivasan Jun 06 '15 at 00:44
  • @Sai "For example, Brahmins are supposed to read and recite Vedas and are not supposed to travel overseas. However it is evident here that they do not really follow any of these." There are certainly lots of Brahmanas today who simply neglect their Varna Dharma, and that is extremely unfortunate; it's a sign that we're living in the Kali Yuga. But I think you're painting with too broad a brush here. There's a very good reason why even the most orthodox Sri Vaishnava Brahamana does not recite the Vedas every day while performing a Yagna, and it has nothing to do with violating the caste system. – Keshav Srinivasan Jun 06 '15 at 01:03
  • @Sai Rather, it's because Sri Vaishnavas follow the Pancharatra texts, and thus they are explicitly sanctioned by the Vedas to give up the performance of the daily Yagna. The excerpt from Yamunacharya's Agama Pramanya linked to in my answer here should clarify things: http://hinduism.stackexchange.com/q/7422/36 Now as far as sea voyages go, the reason why a sea voyage is problematic is two-fold: one because you can't perform Nitya Karmas while not on dry land, and the second because it's a problem if contact with the non-Hindus leads you to not perform Nitya Karmas. – Keshav Srinivasan Jun 06 '15 at 01:15
  • @Sai The first is not a serious issue in modern times, considering that sea voyages or plane voyages don't typically last more than a few days at a stretch without going onto land, so the lengths of time that are problematic don't really arise. The second is not an issue either as long as you still do your dharma while in foreign countries. But the mere presence in foreign countries does not require expiation, as Govinda's commentary on the Baudhayana Dharma Sutras make clear. – Keshav Srinivasan Jun 06 '15 at 01:19
  • @KeshavSrinivasan you're absolutely right, I'm so sorry! I didnt for a second refer to the Sri Vaishnava tradition when I said that. This was a general sense of how Brahmins around the world use the concept of 'caste' for their own purposes, rather than motivated by any scriptural reasons. Whereas what you're talking about is a specific case of how sincere Sri Vaishnavas do not conform to the rules, for good reasons. But I am sure you would agree that not all Brahmins are motivated by those same reasons as you are. I am willing to explain more if you need clarification. All the best... – Sai Jun 06 '15 at 03:57
  • @Sai Yeah, I definitely agree that there are large numbers of Brahmins who are ignoring their Varna Dharma for no justifiable reason. Like I said, it's a sign of the Kali Yuga. By the way, this isn't something unique to Sri Vaishnavism; almost all mainstream Vaishnavas are part of the Pancharatra tradition. (There's a small group of non-Pancharatra-following Vishnu worshippers known as Vaikhanasas, but they have a similar justification for not doing Yagnas.). It's also worth noting that being in the Pancharatra tradition frees you from having to do Yagnas, but it imposes new duties on you. – Keshav Srinivasan Jun 06 '15 at 04:22
  • @Sai Those duties mainly involve devotional service to Vishnu. (Basically the idea is that Vishnu is the god of the Yagna, so worshipping him can susbstitute for actually doing a Yagna.) On a side note, you may be familiar with the statement in numerous Puranas that what can be obtained in the Satya Yuga by Tapasya, and in the Treta Yuga by Yagnas, and in the Dwapara Yuga by serving the lotus feet of Vishnu, can be obtained in the Kali Yuga merely by chanting the name of Vishnu. The procedure that was used in the Dwapara Yuga to serve Vishnu (while he was incarnate as Krishna) was Pancharatra. – Keshav Srinivasan Jun 06 '15 at 04:32
  • This question is closed and it is not about duties of certain castes or whether members of such castes observe them. I think it's a good time to move this into a chat room since this conversation is off-topic. – pgpb.padilla Jun 06 '15 at 04:47

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