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The Skeptic's Dictionary while arguing that astrology is nothing more than a superstition brings up some interesting questions:

Astrologers emphasize the importance of the positions of the Sun, Moon, planets, etc., at the time of birth. However, the birthing process isn’t instantaneous. There is no single moment that a person is born. The fact that some official somewhere writes down a time of birth is irrelevant.

  1. Do they pick the moment the water breaks? The moment the first dilation occurs? When the first hair or toenail peeks through? When the last toenail or hair passes the last millimeter of the vagina? When the umbilical cord is cut? When the first breath is taken? Or does birth occur at the moment a physician or nurse looks at a clock to note the time of birth?

  2. Why are the initial conditions more important than all subsequent conditions for one’s personality and traits?

  3. Why is the moment of birth chosen as the significant moment rather than the moment of conception?

I'm looking for answers to some or all of the above with regard to Hindu astrology.

Say No To Censorship
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  • To answer the first question, it doesn't matter exactly what moment you consider the moment of birth, because for instance what matters in the calculation of Janma Rashi is what region in the zodiac (the band of stars surrounding the Sun's path in the sky) the moon is in at the time of birth, not what what specific point in the zodiac the moon is in at the time of birth. Presumably the moon will be in the same region of the zodiac in the moment the baby starts coming out and the moment the baby finishes coming out. – Keshav Srinivasan Apr 24 '17 at 18:05
  • Concerning the second question, the gods choose the time of birth for a given individual according to his personality and other characteristics. – Keshav Srinivasan Apr 24 '17 at 18:07
  • @KeshavSrinivasan, the janma nakshatram can vary within the duration of child birth. also, does this hold for induced/premature/C-section babies ? – ram Apr 24 '17 at 18:09
  • @ram Well, presumably it would be predetermined that a given person would be born prematurely or have a C-section. – Keshav Srinivasan Apr 24 '17 at 18:19
  • "it doesn't matter exactly what moment you consider the moment of birth..." - But I've heard even a difference of single minute changes one's stars. – Say No To Censorship Apr 24 '17 at 18:37
  • "...the gods choose the time of birth" - why do Gods need to 'choose' the time of birth? Why should personality and traits be connected to time of birth? Why can't they be independent? – Say No To Censorship Apr 24 '17 at 18:38
  • @sv. Well, for one thing it allows a person to know his characteristics, course of life, etc. – Keshav Srinivasan Apr 24 '17 at 19:25
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    @KeshavSrinivasan better to avoid commenting in subjects which you are not familiar with. the moment is very important because the birth chart is not based on position of moon but mainly on the ascendant or "lagna". – Rakesh Joshi Apr 24 '17 at 19:55
  • @RakeshJoshi I was talking about Janma Rashi. Janma Rashi is based on the moon. – Keshav Srinivasan Apr 24 '17 at 20:11
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    @KeshavSrinivasan janma rashi is not much useful. it can be only used for transits and its effects. – Rakesh Joshi Apr 25 '17 at 07:38
  • @RakeshJoshi My point applies equally well to Janma Lagna - the calculation of Janma Lagna depends on the which region of the zodiac the Eastern horizon was aligned with at the time of birth, it doesn't depend on which specific point of the zodiac the Eastern horizon was aligned with at the time of birth. – Keshav Srinivasan Apr 25 '17 at 08:25
  • @KeshavSrinivasan ascendant changes in every 1.5 -2.5 hours. sometimes it in the sandhi of two ascendants. Further, with every degree and kalaa of moon, there is change in the progression of dasha (major and minor periods) even a five -10 minutes difference can cause diffference of months or years in the dasha. Further it has direct impact on the divisional (varga) charts too. – Rakesh Joshi Apr 25 '17 at 08:37
  • @RakeshJoshi Yeah, Sandhis can be a problem. – Keshav Srinivasan Apr 25 '17 at 08:39
  • @KeshavSrinivasan even if not sandhi then too dashas and divisional charts would change... so time is very very vital. – Rakesh Joshi Apr 25 '17 at 08:46
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    Edit your Q to remove references to the skeptic's dictionary and ask for jyotisha's take. I don't believe compare and contrast is allowed on this SE. Hinduism need not satisfy any skeptic. –  Apr 26 '17 at 12:22
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    @moonstar2001 See this question as an example: K.S. Bhagavan's critique of Adi Shankara. So all questions from critics, atheists, skeptics etc. are allowed on this forum, although may not be welcome. 'Hinduism need not satisfy any skeptic' - true, but this site doesn't have a monopoly on Hinduism and is not just for followers of Hinduism. – Say No To Censorship Apr 26 '17 at 22:35
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    @sv. You are quite right that atheism, doubts and questions are welcome and should be welcomed in Hinduism. If no question is raisen , then Hindu philosophy would turn no less than a Heresy. –  Apr 30 '17 at 21:07
  • @sv. Also I have found, reading from various sources, introspection, arguments, that in some or the other way the things mentioned in Scriptures turn out to be true. So there is always an explanation to every question. The only problem is we do not get the proper way to combine various sources to produce the perfect answer for a particular question.You are quiet correct as for time if birth. I personally think that you can take the mean average time, when the birth started and ended. Moreover,2-3 minutes do not matter enough. Even if dasha timings change, it is so minimal, and hence ignorable. –  Apr 30 '17 at 21:15
  • @AnuragSingh "that in some or the other way the things mentioned in Scriptures turn out to be true" - would you say the same thing (about Hindu scripture) if you're born into a different religion? :) – Say No To Censorship Apr 30 '17 at 21:21
  • @sv. Even I used to asked this question to myself. Actually, I have always looked out for truth- be it in Hinduism, Islam, Christianity, or any others. I was the greatest atheist who condemned all religions, thinking them to be orthodox based superstitions. But I started studying Hindu Scriptures deeply(not very deeply, but without hatred).I had a view that Hinduism is like an orthodox based heretic system, but I found that the scriptures contain more about arguments, philosophies,and speculations that have not been culminated just by some Imagination, they have been really thoroughly studied. –  May 01 '17 at 05:45
  • So I believed t hat yes there is no one-rule sect in Hinduism, and it is very precise. But honestly speaking, I believed that Islam, Christianity, others were stories.But I argued, so I checked for various articles about other religion(I hate this word religion). So I saw that these are also true. And since Islam is the next most familiar to me, so I started looking at it a bit. Not intending any exorbitance, but indeed I started disregarding Hinduism. I really like the concept Allah is just formless, omnipotent. But then I again saw that Islam is also not different that Hinduism. –  May 01 '17 at 05:46
  • So I really found(again, no exaggeration) all religions are really true and same.I really amuse at people calling(rather tagging) themselves as Hindu, Muslim, Christian, Jain, et cetera. And as for my following Hinduism-I never believe in it like a fear stricken naive child. I always criticise and question against many concepts in Hinduism, and especially the things against women. I am not an atheist, but sometimes when in some official forms there is a section to fill- "Please write your religion", I put a blank there. (again, no extravagance) –  May 01 '17 at 05:47
  • @AnuragSingh You can join this chat for further comments: Rational Thinkers. – Say No To Censorship May 03 '17 at 19:24
  • The chat subject is popular. Belief in astrological influence on life course, life duration and fate will be popularly supported, its belief is rampant in all cultures. In case of Jesus, Buddha astrologers found a possibility of a great soul arriving later on, a stand vindicated later. As for time of birth planned by parents we don't know of C-section births giving rise to brighter children. I knew of some grand parents advice to keep off from spouses ,to avoid unfavorable date and time of birth 280 days hence!. But accuracy is important and so finally all births are randomly timed. – Narasimham Mar 15 '18 at 18:07

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The first breathe coming out of the body is the one we must look for because breathe is a unit of time measure as per the Rishis.

The below is from Surya Siddhanth : Chapter 1 verse 12 in Phanindra Ganguly's translation.

  1. And sixty nadis make a sidereal day and night....

The manuscripts without commentary insert, as the first half of v. 11, the usual definition of the length of a respiration: " the time occupied in pronouncing ten long syllables is called a respiration. '

The table of the divisions of sidereal time is then as follow: 10 long syllables (gurvaftshara) = 1 respiration (prana, period of four seconds); 6 respirations = 1 vinadi (period of twenty-four seconds); 60 vinadis = 1 nadi (period of twenty-four minutes); 60 nadis = 1 day.

Rama27
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