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Is there any reason that we couldn't believe in life on another planet somewhere? Is there any source that indicates to the contrary?

Al Berko
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Y     e     z
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    Highly related:http://judaism.stackexchange.com/q/9197 – Fred Jul 24 '14 at 23:54
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    I realize you are asking for proof of negation, but I will just mention that in the book Thinking aloud, Rav Soloveitchik is recorded as saying alien life is definitely possible and that there may even be an Am Hanivchor for that planet! – user6591 Jul 25 '14 at 01:58
  • @Fred My question could really be taken as a subset of that question. But I don't think it's a dupe. – Y     e     z Jul 25 '14 at 03:09
  • Why doesn't the reference to the Sefer HaIkkarim stated there satisfy this question? – Yishai Jul 25 '14 at 13:21
  • I believe the Lubovitcher Rebbe said that bieng that Torah does not say otherwise it is certainly possible. But that there definatly is no Am Hanivchor for that planet. – mroll Jul 25 '14 at 13:55
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    What do you mean by "believe in"? Believe simply that "life on another planet somewhere" exists? Believe that it represents some kind of deus ex machina? – Tamir Evan Jul 25 '14 at 16:00
  • @TamirEvan I meant the first and don't understand what you mean by the second. – Y     e     z Jul 25 '14 at 18:12
  • Another point came to mind. I'm assuming the major problem people would have with believing in life on other planets is the fact that the Torah didn't mention their creation. There is a Zohar which mentions people that are not born of Adam Harishon. Its found in Vayikra daf yud, a famous maareh makom for being where the roundness of the world is discussed and rejected. – user6591 Jul 25 '14 at 20:23
  • @YEZ Beyond believing that something exists, an unqualified "believe in" can also mean trusting in the goodness, efficacy, or ability of something, and even attributing higher (god-like) powers to it. In my opinion, a better phrasing of the question could be: "Is there any reason that we couldn't believe in the existence of life on another planet somewhere?" Or: "Is there any reason that we couldn't believe that life exists on another planet somewhere?" – Tamir Evan Jul 27 '14 at 14:53
  • @TamirEvan I suppose so. I think my usage is the standard usage. When a child says they "believe in monsters" I don't think they mean that monsters have been transmitting prophecy and performing miracles. And I think the title made it that much clearer. – Y     e     z Jul 27 '14 at 17:31
  • There was a professor (I don't recall his name) who was searching for life on mars, and became frum. He asked the Rebbe if it's alright, and the Rebbe said he should continue, and if he doesn't find there, he should look elsewhere, because to say there no life on another planet is limiting Hashem. There's a possuk "Orur Maroiz orur yoshveha..." "Cursed is maroiz cursed is it's inhabitants" (shoftim-haftoras beshalach) rashi says one explanation is it's a planet. – user3931926 Aug 12 '14 at 12:44
  • I think the question MUST be rephrased into "Does Judaism allow for the existence of conscious extra-terrestrial life in our Universe." 1. It's about theoretical thinking, not believing, 2. Must define "aliens" - microbes might me also considered aliens 3. Must point to our Universe as opposed to other non-overlapping universes. – Al Berko Mar 21 '19 at 08:22
  • How do you test the freewill if you find an alien? How do you know if he's acting on his own and not wirelessly controlled by a supercomputer? How do we know he's not an angel disguised as an alien? How do we know that G-d does not test us at all? We are pretty much doomed on this question. – Al Berko Mar 21 '19 at 14:10
  • @AlBerko Most of your points are practical points and have absolutely nothing to do with this question. I never asked how you, or anyone else, would know and verify such life, or its sentient nature - I only asked if in principle the existence of such life would be incompatible with Torah. And, I don't think it is the obligation of an asker to rule out things which modern physics isn't even sure exists. – Y     e     z Mar 24 '19 at 05:25
  • I'm sorry, I didn't mean to harass. I intended to stress the very uncertainty of such a finding. Unless Hashem Himself or a prophet testifies that those are true aliens we cannot be sure. And that, unfortunately, invalidates the question. – Al Berko Mar 24 '19 at 07:51
  • @AlBerko I don't see in what way it invalidates the question even if you were correct. But I asked for a philosophical reason why they could not exist, not for proof that they do, so again your comments are irrelevant. – Y     e     z Mar 26 '19 at 05:42
  • Let me clarify: Your question can be relevant only if we can reliably verify an alien being. For example - you meet a squid or Yeti - is it an alien? Or you find one on Jupiter - would it be considered an alien? In order to "defy" the Rabbinic view (we are the only conscious humanoids in OUR Universe), we have to agree on the definition of an alien and a way to verify its alienness. Meantime I don't find a way of doing that. Do you? – Al Berko Mar 26 '19 at 07:52
  • Maybe I'm still unclear: when you say "why THEY could not exist" please define THEY. – Al Berko Mar 26 '19 at 07:53
  • @AlBerko You accidentally hit on what my question actually is, as opposed to what you consistently are misrepresenting it to be. When you said "to 'defy' the Rabbinic view (we are the only conscious humanoids in OUR Universe)", without any support of the claim of what the Rabbinic view is, you pinpointed exactly what my question is - can you provide any evidence as to the "Rabbinic view" being what you characterized it to be? If you peruse some of the answers I got for this question, you'll see that your assumption is rather unwarranted. – Y     e     z Mar 26 '19 at 13:52
  • @AlBerko Yes! Aliens do not exist. Unless you want to call Columbus one, there have never been any UFOs’ and the Torah as well as Deborah is silent on the matter. – Turk Hill Oct 24 '19 at 16:12

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The Sefer Hikrim brings his rebbe which held that there are no aliens. However the Sefer Hikrim himself argues and holds that there are aliens. He brings a proof from the possuk in Shoftim which says "oro mroz", which the gamera in Moed Katan (Rashi brings this) says roz is a star, and the passuk concludes "arur yoshveha" cursed are its inhabitants, clearly there is some form of life in space.

kenorb
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heffe
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In this article, Rabbi Aryeh Kaplan sources and discusses opinions on both sides of the argument, bringing various proofs and questions.

Chasdai Crescas says aliens can exist, Yosef Albo said there cannot be any other beings with free will, apparently the only objection with believing in aliens centers around this issue of free will. Rabbi Kaplan also quotes the Sefer HaBris who took the middle road saying they exist, but do not have free will. Rabbi Kaplan goes on to say that the Zohar seems to support belief in extra terrestrial life.

user6591
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User6591 answered based on the essay entitled "On Extraterrestrial Life" by Rabbi Kaplan that there are mutiple opinions. That essay is written in the same author's book, Moreh Ohr on pp. 47-50. All of the relevant information is laid out and presented with the relevant passages quoted in their original. He then concludes with this:

We see from this [starting on p. 47] that there is a singular species in the world that is capable of free will, Torah, reward and punishment which are the purpose of creation. This is mankind, to whom God has given The One Torah. It is however possible that there exists many species of living creatures on other stars i.e. planets, which may even be capable of intelligence and wisdom, just not freewill. The subject of freewill is but a very small item as it is, that cannot be verified in science [or by scientists], only by belief in our Torah. And if they do find additional species of living creatures, we have already learned from the Torah that don't have freewill.

Dr. Shmuel
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Rav Meir Mazuz has a very interesting article on it which he claims there are no life on other planets as on earth.

The torah's word is above everything, above all the professor's, above all the scientists. All their words are null and void against one word of torah!

For example: "in the beginning, G-d created the heavens and the earth" (Gen.1:1). The deniers came along and said: This is false! The earth is part of the heaven. We once had a book called "the heavens" (by the french astronomer, K.Palmerion). He wrote there: "the heavens are everything. Don't think the heavens are one thing and the earth is another. Rather, the earth is just one planet in the heaven!" He was not the first to say this. After it was discovered that all the planets revolve around the sun, then all the scientists also held this view.

Thus they said, what is this: "the heavens and the earth!?" (Gen 1:1)

When they reached this conclusion, they asked themselves: "just like there are human beings on the earth, so too there must be on other planets. There must exist also on the moon, on mars, on venus, mercury, etc.

In truth, there were some torah sages who thought like this. In the days of the Chacham Tzvi, there was a Rav talmid chacham, tzadik, G-d fearing, by the name of David Nito, author of the book Matei Dan. There they asked him: "what do you think of what the scientists say that there are human beings on the moon?". He answered: "Why not? If they tell you there are human beings in India, will you say they walk upside down or they have three eyes?! Of course not. All are the same. So too here. All the planets are the same".

Eventually, this matter was proven false. When? About fifty years ago, when they went up on the moon and saw no men, no horses, etc. There's no air and no water. All desolate wasteland (at that time, Rabbi Nissan Pinson told me: "slowly, slowly they will realize that there is no place fit for life like planet earth".)

For the "heavens" is a vast sphere which has nothing, while the "earth" has so many interesting things. There are human beings, animals, trees, grasses, and there are people who recognize their Creator, pray to Him and thank Him.

This is what is written: "in the beginning, G-d created the heavens and the earth". It has already been fifty years, since the scientists search against this. But in truth, there is nothing. Period.

One word of torah is worth more than all the scientists' words together! They are all as dust and ashes against it. So too, for everything else written in the torah. (from Rabbi Mazuz's weekly class. Parsha Tzav 5778) note: this phenomena is happening also in physics, biology, cosmology, etc. For example, the scientists expected living cells to be simple but even the simplest bacteria turned out to be an intense world of bewildering complexity. Likewise for everything. Even the tiny atom is an intense world of mathematics which gets more complex the more you go in.

Rh Haokip
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  • Thanks for the source. He does seem to take it for granted that it is problematic to claim there is life elsewhere in the Universe, but it's unclear exactly from where he gets that starting point. – Y     e     z Mar 24 '19 at 05:36
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According to my understanding of the Torah, and my logic:

  1. Torah is one and unchangeable

  2. Only Adam was created בצלמנו כדמותנו and יודע טוב ורע and only his descendants can qualify as such.

  3. While we didn't see men leaving Earth for other planets, there could be no human-like, sentient life besides humans.

If you asked such a question to Rambam or the Geonim or the Sages that would be definitely considered heresy as the Earth was flat and there was a clear distinction between the Earth and Heavens (see Rambam's Yesodey Hatorah - everything he spoke of was physical to him and his generation). All of the sudden אנן סהדי that we can fly into the skies and there's no רקיע - firmament whatsoever, so we immediately rewrite Judaism to accommodate for that apparent knowledge.

Therefore the most problematic part in this question - what do we call Judaism? How far can we deviate from our Rabbis' understanding of the Torah to fit it into contemporary science? I really don't know what the limits are.

DonielF
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Al Berko
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  • I think you mean to say sentient, not just conscious, life besides humans. Animals are also conscious, but they’re not sentient. 2. There’s a big difference between “rewriting Judaism” when it comes to things like the רקיע, which don’t make such a big impact on Halacha and Hashkafah, and “rewriting Judaism” to completely overturn a basis of it - that man is unique in his free will.
    • – DonielF Mar 21 '19 at 14:09
  • @DonielF 1. maybe, feel free to edit. 2. "according to Judaism" is a very hard to define term. My point is to be aware of the relativity of it and our ability to bend Judaism into just about anything. – Al Berko Mar 21 '19 at 14:19
  • To a certain extent, yes, Judaism is a bit flexible. But there are certain lines which cannot be crossed: you can't, for instance, torture Judaism into saying that idolatry is ordinarily okay, or that one can wantonly break Shabbos because he feels like it when he knows better. There are certain facts which are immutable, and the uniqueness of man in terms of his sentience and free will are among them. I agree with everything in this post, until the horizontal rule. – DonielF Mar 21 '19 at 14:22
  • @DonielF I also wanted to believe that, but think about the Cherubim - we say it's OK in Kodesh Hakodashim. We, humans, will believe just about anything the authorities tell us. Think about it. What would be needed for you to break Shabbos - how much of social pressure, Rabbinical decrees etc? I also thought I'm "unmovable", but realized, I'm just another social creature. – Al Berko Mar 21 '19 at 14:26
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    Re the Kerubim: take a look at Shemos 20:20 - they're not idols if and only if they are made in a specific way. If they're made even slightly differently, they are indeed considered idols. Re Shabbos: Perhaps that's true, but that doesn't mean it's permissible to break Shabbos in such a case; it just means that we're human. – DonielF Mar 21 '19 at 14:28
  • @DonielF Are you familiar with the en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bean_machine - Judaism is not different. Every Rabbi is a pin and has a 50-50 chance of bouncing the Halacha to permit or forbid. The final distribution is what Judaism is today but all the outcomes are equally probable. – Al Berko Mar 21 '19 at 14:34
  • Let us continue this discussion in chat. – DonielF Mar 21 '19 at 14:35
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    Points #2 and #3 need a source – robev Mar 22 '19 at 17:54